c-a-r-f-r-e-w
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A step on the way toward the demise of the liberal elite? Or just a blip…
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Aug 9, 2023 7:45:17 GMT
I understand why SUnak and his crew are intent on these niche culture war issues - because it's all they'e got. But the polls continue to show that it's not changing any minds. The reason is that all the people who get wound up by all this ridiculous posturing are already in the Tories corner, that's where their persistent 20s polling comes from. It's highly unlikely that anyone who hadn't already jumped to them will be swayed at this late stage by even more extreme right wing positions. Indeed it's possible that there may still be a few one nation Tories hanging on in there because of a general antipathy to Labour but yesterday's defence of the atrocious remarks by 3p Lee might be the final straw. We'll see over the next few polls but unless a miracle happens to the economy or Sunak has a personality and morality conversion, these poll numbers are baked in now. Have wondered if they are trying to reprise the Cameron recipe, because he got re-elected and turned around a polling deficit, despite austerity, by majoring on the vans and stuff. But, maybe people were a bit more accepting of austerity back then, and anyway they hadn’t just had partygate and the Truss economic meltdown and got rid of Johnson and then Truss. Plus they had the LDs to front some of the unpopular policies and take some of the flak… Are some possible factors… |
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Post by crossbat11 on Aug 9, 2023 7:46:13 GMT
barbara
It's called dog whistling the Tory diehards back home in time for the next election. Getting from 28% to 32% seems about the best case scenario for them now, I think.
P.S. Another electoral consideration may be at play here too. I suspect Tory strategists advising Sunak are starting to fear that their right flank is being exposed again. Farage is re-emerging Dracula-like and threatening to cause electoral mischief and Tice is reviving Reform UK's fortunes too. The heady days of 2017 and 2019 and a united Right voting bloc are starting to disappear. Sunak may be now trying to keep some of that ex-UKIP/Brexit vote on board while keeping the core vote loyal by frightening them about Labour. That's the strategy in a nutshell.
Still don't see it getting them much beyond Michael Howard 2005 territory though.
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 9, 2023 7:46:37 GMT
Thinking about the anti Tory vote, at what point does it become less than credible to lend a vote to a party that won't call out the outrageous xenophobia of the Tories and won't address the blindingly obvious disastrous impact of their Brexit policy on our rights, freedoms and economy.
Not there yet but a few more silence is golden moments could be the tipping point.
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 9, 2023 7:57:17 GMT
On the subject of the Traitor.
His appointed ignoramus judge in the Florida documents case showing her lack of judicial knowledge yet again.
Following on from maga talking points questioning why a grand jury out with Florida can still seek evidence of additional crimes relating to the existing documents cases.
It's because that's the settled law.
I've no in depth knowledge of U.S. constitutional law and my interest in their legal system is primarily based on the fact that several of my American relatives were in law enforcement there and I feel a connection.
But I knew that and I'm not a frickin judge.
Judge Cannon isn't just inappropriate her nearly total lack of trial experience as an attorney or judge make her completely inappropriate for this trial, putting aside her blatant pro maga bias.
She needs to recuse herself.
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Post by alec on Aug 9, 2023 7:59:38 GMT
Interesting from the JVCI, and now government policy. They are restricting covid boosters to the over 65s only, along with a limited set defined as clinically vulnerable. They've also announced that the primary course of covid jabs is now going to be a single shot, so any unvaccinated people entering the over 65 category will be offered a single jab only. At the same time, they are withdrawing the offer of a free flu shot for the over 50s, restricting to over 65s again. This is really rather peculiar. Evidence from Japan is not good. They had high vax levels but quite some time ago, and have seen covid cases rise for 17 straight weeks (based on hospital acquired data) with a 14% increase in the latest week, so no real signs of things slowing down. This wasn't apparently due to notable new variants, so presumably largely just immune waning. Their well funded hospital system faced substantial problems in many areas, running out of beds and facing real strain in pediatric wards in some regions, with these issues now spreading as the cases sweep northwards through the country.
I can't really see what the JVCI thinks we're going to gain from restricting both covid and flu jabs. The Australian flu season appears to be not as bad as 2022 but worse than average, and with a huge waiting list, you would have thought that anything that reduces NHS pressure this winter would be grabbed with both hands.
Really not sure what's going on here.
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Post by barbara on Aug 9, 2023 8:06:08 GMT
barbara I doubt if it ever will ,those who think that way are already guaranteed tork/kip voters. I appreciate Starmer seems to think they are really " traditional Labour voters" but I doubt that particular total bollocks will impact the result of the general election , other than to further make a Labour vote simply a vehicle to get rid of the tories. My own vote is governed by A party that seems to share most of my values And of course getting the tories out. Currently there is no contradiction between the two , it might get a tad trickier at a general election, but to be honest the current Labour leadership isn't doing much to encourage me and other progressive supporters to lend them out vote. If it's obviously the only way to get rid of the Tory incumbent I will but with zero enthusiasm regarding vanilla Brexit with a cherry on the top labour To be honest that's what a lot of us did in 2019. I would have voted for a pig on a stick if it would have helped defeat Johnson and avoid the ridiculously hard and unrealistic Brexit we've ended up with. As it was I held my nose and voted Corbyn as it was my best anti Tory vote. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2023 8:07:10 GMT
Shock Report.
Algerian asylum seeker says barge is "fine" and food and bed are "good" as he walks around Weymouth.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2023 8:08:49 GMT
I wonder if the Tony Blair Institute will be the Wagner of Starmers administration. ?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2023 8:13:17 GMT
On the subject of the Traitor. His appointed ignoramus judge in the Florida documents case showing her lack of judicial knowledge yet again. Following on from maga talking points questioning why a grand jury out with Florida can still seek evidence of additional crimes relating to the existing documents cases. It's because that's the settled law. I've no in depth knowledge of U.S. constitutional law and my interest in their legal system is primarily based on the fact that several of my American relatives were in law enforcement there and I feel a connection. But I knew that and I'm not a frickin judge. Judge Cannon isn't just inappropriate her nearly total lack of trial experience as an attorney or judge make her completely inappropriate for this trial, putting aside her blatant pro maga bias. She needs to recuse herself. Should Cannon be fired? |
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Aug 9, 2023 8:17:50 GMT
Trying to be non controversial, thinking about which groups are having the most pernicious and malign influence on the UK at the moment, then it's clearly the tory party To give a mercian disclaimer I am not labelling all tories as this, but a group of hard right fundamentalists backed by dodgy shadowy extreme libertarian think tanks, who themselves are opaquely funded by foreign interests have captured the tory party and are engaged in a culture war to try and smash our open and tolerant society As I said not all tories agree with this sect, but of course failing to speak out about it could imply consent I hope this post will be seen as non controversial and something we can all agree upon? |
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Aug 9, 2023 8:21:23 GMT
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 9, 2023 8:23:45 GMT
colinAbuse of human rights , torture and illegal imprisonment are common in Algeria I've been to Weymouth it's a bit better real shock that someone seeking refugee status finds the place they are seeking it an improvement on where they are fleeing from. Does it not occur to you that the floating open prison might be somewhat more comfortable with just a handful of inmates than it will be if the regime manage to cram 500, more than double the designed maximum in to it!
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Aug 9, 2023 8:42:45 GMT
Government are open about wasting tax payers money now
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2023 8:44:50 GMT
One all.  |
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Post by crossbat11 on Aug 9, 2023 8:52:00 GMT
I wonder if the Tony Blair Institute will be the Wagner of Starmers administration. ? A question that I'm finding on the minds of nearly everyone I'm speaking to at the moment. 🤔😆 |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2023 8:56:45 GMT
I wonder if the Tony Blair Institute will be the Wagner of Starmers administration. ? A question that I'm finding on the minds of nearly everyone I'm speaking to at the moment. 🤔😆 But they,'re not supposed to know !  |
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c-a-r-f-r-e-w
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A step on the way toward the demise of the liberal elite? Or just a blip…
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Aug 9, 2023 9:03:26 GMT
there’s quite often another tunnel after the light anyway. (A cheery thought for the day) Very true, certainly on the Worcester-Birmingham canal. Tardebigge, Shortwood and Wasthills tunnels all within about five miles of each other. Wasthills tunnel, some 1.25 miles long, is the third longest on the British canal system. It travels under Birmingham City FC's training ground. As I glide through the tunnel in a narrow boat, in almost total darkness, I sing Villa songs throughout the 25 minutes it takes to get through. Despite being partial to a bit of Worcester Whimsy and associated Mercian things, I racked my brains on the matter of canals in Birmingham, environs of, and found myself unable to add anything whatsoever of merit. (Or even of demerit, which is unusual for me). However, in desperation I saw you had mentioned the training ground, which had me wondering what might be happening to our training ground now that we are under new management, and it seems it’s getting an upgrade, which is quite good as it was somewhat lacking. So thanks for that Batterz… |
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Post by crossbat11 on Aug 9, 2023 9:06:04 GMT
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c-a-r-f-r-e-w
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A step on the way toward the demise of the liberal elite? Or just a blip…
Posts: 6,721
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Aug 9, 2023 9:11:29 GMT
if only it were non-government, he said wistfully… |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2023 9:59:36 GMT
How would they know that? |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2023 10:01:57 GMT
One all. Asylum seeker says the barge isn’t bad - but it’s not great. Penalty shootout. ⚽️ |
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Aug 9, 2023 11:01:16 GMT
I'm intrigued by your response about using offpeak renewable electricity. You are probably correct. It would be much more effective to use the output from nuclear stations (which we seldom need as baseload) to provide the power for electrolysis. That would only require the electrolysis process to be briefly interrupted, when there was insufficient wind/tide/solar. The output from offpeak wind/solar would just be an additional benefit. Then you are saying the Uk will have a policy of generating all its power from nuclear. Nuclear is 'always on' technology. Not only is it difficult to quickly regulate the outout from such a power station, but if you do turn it off then you are essentially throwing away that electricity, because the greatest part of the costs is not the fuel but the complex equipment with an essentially finite and fixed lifetime. Nuclear power is intrinsicly more expensive than renewables becuse of this complexity. Renewables fit very well with simpler fossil technology which can be much more easily switched on and off, and once off the savings are direct because no fuel is being used and that is where the cost lies. In fact, if the whole world moved to a mixed technology of renewables to the max plus fossil to fill in, we would have cut fossil consumption by I guess 90% without complication arguing about new technologies, and a lot more cheaply. Thats the obvious pragmatic solution. In this vein using any surplus power for generating hydrogen would make sense despite inefficiencies because it could be added to mined gas to reduce fossil usage further, plus again the technology all already exists. This works because the surplus renewables power is essentially free, and indeed right now we are paying people to throw it away. Obviously massively improving the insulation standards of homes is going to help whatever else you do. But of course our government halted the subsidy schemes to do that, and without them it was economically dubious for many owners, especially after the obvious and simplest measures. The reason for stopping using fossil is to prevent global warming and extreme economic costs resulting from that. As such this is a cost government will bear eventually. Individual home owners do not see this cost, their calculation is just about the cheapest way to heat their homes. Its the same problem as the london pollution charges, individuals will not sign up for personal cost. This has to be born nationally to make these schemes work. Con are fundamentally opposed to government taking responsibility in that way. |
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Post by alec on Aug 9, 2023 11:02:24 GMT
colin - "I wonder if the Tony Blair Institute will be the Wagner of Starmers administration. ?" Not sure where that came from, but are you aware that it's actually rather offensive? On your barge post, I've been a bit nonplussed about the fuss over the principle of the barge idea. Aside from the issue of the fire safety standards, which would be unforgivable if the fire service views are accurate, I can't see why it's such a bad idea. We have a lot of migrants who need somewhere safe and warm to stay, and if done properly, a floating accommodation seems like a reasonable option.
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Post by leftieliberal on Aug 9, 2023 11:03:28 GMT
mercian The average size and weight of normally aspirated cars is around 20% higher than it was in 1980, car parks haven't routinely collapsed under the additional weight. But it does explain why the parking bays routinely seem too small. It's not that they've changed it's the cars that are bigger. The big change since the 1980s has been the introduction of the Euro NCAP standards en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euro_NCAPEssentially, to make cars safer, manufacturers have increased the crumple zones (which means a lower peak deceleration in collisions) and because this includes side impacts the cars have to be wider. My 1930s garage (now demolished and replaced) was barely wide enough to allow me to open the driver's door of my 1979 Metro enough that I could squeeze out and nowhere near wide enough for me to do the same in my 2001 Peugeot 206. |
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Aug 9, 2023 11:09:00 GMT
In my case as I have said before, it was about sovereignty. If we elect a government with any balls (sorry ladies) we could get out of those treaties if we wanted to. Could we have done from within the EU? Could we bring back the death penalty? Could we export to the USA in their units? And so on. I'm not saying any of these things will happen because nearly all of our politicians are spineless, but the whole point is that they now could happen if the right politicians were elected. The current government could abrogate the treaties requiring us to take refugees. But they are afraid to because the Uk would then drop out of all sorts of international agreements. They understand that this would harm the Uk more than it would help. The same was true of Brexit, it has harmned the Uk more than it has created any freedoms. Conservatves knew this of course, and they spent years trying to find a form of brexit which would compromise and save some of the parts most beneficial to the Uk. but they couldnt, because its a package deal. The package was always to our benefit, but they could find no loophole to allow them to keep it and still claim to have carried out brexit. Brexit happened because it enabled con to become the government. Cameron got his time as PM. May did, Johnson did. To them personally, that was worth the destruction of the UK which has and will result. |
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domjg
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Post by domjg on Aug 9, 2023 11:11:09 GMT
colin - "I wonder if the Tony Blair Institute will be the Wagner of Starmers administration. ?" Not sure where that came from, but are you aware that it's actually rather offensive? On your barge post, I've been a bit nonplussed about the fuss over the principle of the barge idea. Aside from the issue of the fire safety standards, which would be unforgivable if the fire service views are accurate, I can't see why it's such a bad idea. We have a lot of migrants who need somewhere safe and warm to stay, and if done properly, a floating accommodation seems like a reasonable option. Where do they get their outdoor time and exposure to nature, walking on water? It's meant to look and feel like a prison to satisfy mean-spirited inhabitants of, for example, England's eastern counties. |
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Aug 9, 2023 11:16:33 GMT
How would they know that? Perhaps they are Clint Eastwood fans |
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Aug 9, 2023 11:16:34 GMT
]It's more nuanced in the US - the problem in Congress in particular is the opposite of what you describe; such moderate parliamentarians as either party had have tended to be squeezed out as the process becomes ever more polarised. You can't legislate by constructive compromise if it just means you'll lose re-nomination to a purist from your own side. I wonder if this is the eventual inevitable outcome of the system of democracy we use, which applies winner takes all. It has not operated in the way it does now for most of history. We started off with two parties with clear differences between them, representing different segments of society. These looked to how they could steal voters from their opponet, so steadily moved towards them in the second phase. But once this had gone as far as it could, causing the two parties to become much more similar, then the politicians start looking elsewhere for votes. And then the extremes come back into play, and suddenly a moderate party agrees to take power by adopting the extreme views on one or another outlier, which however is enough to ensure they win and take all. But the price is extreme policies no one much likes. Its the only way for the individual politicians to get time in office, which is what they are after.
The system encourages extremes to take power.
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Aug 9, 2023 11:21:23 GMT
As I understand the issue with the barge is that it was designed for short term stays for 250 people
Now it's being used long term for 500 people
Rooms originally used for 2 people, are now used for 4 people
There is little or no storage space and people will have to live out of suitcases
While there is only a small number living on it as present, not a great issue, when it becomes full the problems will become evident
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Post by leftieliberal on Aug 9, 2023 11:23:48 GMT
colin - "I wonder if the Tony Blair Institute will be the Wagner of Starmers administration. ?" Not sure where that came from, but are you aware that it's actually rather offensive? On your barge post, I've been a bit nonplussed about the fuss over the principle of the barge idea. Aside from the issue of the fire safety standards, which would be unforgivable if the fire service views are accurate, I can't see why it's such a bad idea. We have a lot of migrants who need somewhere safe and warm to stay, and if done properly, a floating accommodation seems like a reasonable option. In the 19th Century we had prison hulks. Is this so different? www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/education/resources/19th-century-prison-ships/life-board/Actually, the one difference is that unlike the prisoners who were required to work; asylum seekers are not allowed to work. The Government's alternative proposal to Rwanda, Ascension Island, isn't that different to transportation of criminals to Australia in the 19th Century. |
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