Danny
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Post by Danny on Dec 19, 2023 8:21:53 GMT
Oh dear! A report suggests that the electricity grid is on track to cost us all £180 per year in unnecessary charges by 2030 because it will be unable to cope with transferring electricity from where it is generated to where it is needed. The report states that already wind generators are being paid to turn off generators, while gas generators are being asked to turn on fossil generators elsewhere purely because they are in a different part of the country where there is demand, but the network is unable to transmit that power.
Basically, national grid as a private company has wholly failed in investing in infrastructure to meet changing demand which was obviously going to take place because of the switch to renewables. It has completely failed to act in the national interest, which is unsurprising because its a private company expected as its goal to make money for shareholders. Its the same saga as the water companies failing to invest in pipework. Thatcherite privatisation has failed the nation so very badly in just about every case.
The refusal of National grid to connect up new providers isnt new, its being failing for years. But it has now reached the point work on switchover to renewables is being halted by National Grid's failure. We need to massively increase installation of public charging points, and places such as motorway service stations are unable to do so because there is inadequate power cabling. NG ought to be prevented from delivering dividends or payments to parent companies until it meets its national responibilities. (as indeed with water companies)
This is yet another trap lying in wait for the new government. And a costly one.
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Dec 19, 2023 8:24:26 GMT
It’s not only pictures that can paint a 1,000 words. Big posters* of that all over our countries please. * I’m an old fashioned boy 🙂👍 That graph shows that waiting lists started to go down as soon as Labour took power. Knowing how slowly bureaucratic organisations respond, that suggests that measures to bring the waiting lists down must have started under Major. Similarly, the instant rise in waiting lists post 2010 could only have been in response to Labour policies. It's hard to tell from the graph but waiting lists grew for the first 8 months until Labour plans and extra spending kicked in. The BMJ reported on it,(link below), nice try though www.bmj.com/content/316/7132/645.14'The British government admitted its embarrassment last week that NHS waiting lists for hospital admission in England have risen by 100000—more than 1000 a week—since Labour came to office last May' It's like an oil tanker it needed time to turn it around Post 2010 waiting lost continued to fall slightly for a few months before tory management took over. Undoubtedly the huge top down NHS reforms by the tories post 2010 plus austerity were the primary reasons for their atrocious record. As for the 17 years of tory failure of the Thatcher/Major years of NHS waiting lists that speaks for itself
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Post by wb61 on Dec 19, 2023 8:57:26 GMT
I know next to nothing about the relationship between attitudes towards immigrants and proportion of immigrants in the population. So I asked Chat GPT. This knows a lot, but is also inclined to make things up. For what it is worth, It said: "Some research suggests that areas with higher proportions of immigrants might actually display more positive attitudes towards immigrants due to increased familiarity and exposure to different cultures. However, this isn't a universal rule, and attitudes can vary widely even within regions with similar immigrant populations." its answer was in fact longer but mainly devoted to unsubstantiated sitting on the fence. One possibility it did not mention was that hostility towards immigrants often reflects their role as a popular explanation for some social pain (poor housing, services, and employment prospects). As immigrants are naturally attracted to places with jobs, they are less likely to be blameed for taking away jobs in these places. But obviously there are a load of other factors and these may include familiarity, etc Difficulty with the debate is that almost any explanation is likely to be true in some locality. Hello charles really good to see you posting hope all is well with you. WB
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steve
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Post by steve on Dec 19, 2023 9:11:14 GMT
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steve
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Post by steve on Dec 19, 2023 9:17:28 GMT
Another good read from ladybird.
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Post by bardin1 on Dec 19, 2023 10:00:32 GMT
Another kick in the teeth for the NHS Thanks, all you privatising privateers www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-67754983Note that, adjusting for inflation, funding has been cut by £525 million since 2014-2015. If only someone had £600million or so spare, less £75million for her dentistry and yacht, to help out......
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steve
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Post by steve on Dec 19, 2023 10:07:55 GMT
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steve
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Post by steve on Dec 19, 2023 10:12:23 GMT
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Post by jib on Dec 19, 2023 10:24:08 GMT
During the actual coalition while unnecessary austerity did impact the nhs significantly it hadn't had much impact on service until around 2013 in 2015 NHS waiting lists were about the same as they were the year before the banker greed financial crisis in 2007. The exponential rise in waiting lists has been since the brexitanian Tories took charge in 2019. Bloody Danny Alexander! That's BOLLOX and you know it! #rememberremember
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Post by Rafwan on Dec 19, 2023 11:17:04 GMT
“I think this debate is too abstract, like many debates on here.”
Ooooo, Mr Hoity Toity!
(Rest of it was good, though.)
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steve
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Post by steve on Dec 19, 2023 11:20:57 GMT
So our resident obsessive thinks there was a Tory lib dems coalition after 2015, we must have missed it!
Maybe stop listening to the voices in your head and look at the graph that was posted instead.
But brexitanians were never big on facts, so keep blaming Danny Alexander.
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Dec 19, 2023 12:02:18 GMT
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Post by Mark on Dec 19, 2023 12:21:20 GMT
@crossbat
Excellent post @ Dec 18, 2023 22:46:30
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Post by robbiealive on Dec 19, 2023 12:58:29 GMT
“I think this debate is too abstract, like many debates on here.” Ooooo, Mr Hoity Toity! (Rest of it was good, though.) INTERNET INTIMACY & VIRTUAL STOCKHOLM SYNDROME I come on here in the festive season for a bit of ineffectual ranting & to abuse the OCD posters (the "eight" who wrecked UKPR 1 with their obsessive proceduralism, from which we were saved by A Wells's idleness & Mark's nimble footwork in creating this site, all credit to him) who post far too much, tho many are keeping a lower profile at the moment than is usual. Forums like this create a "virtual Stockholm syndrome". People with decidedly opposing & indeed hostile views, people who have never met, never will meet, & even if they did meet would probably despise each other, develop, thru constant interaction, a fake, a false internet intimacy. Eg., if if one of the OCDs doesn't post for a while one or more of the others will express concern for their welfare. Odd. The exception one would allow is Charles, the site's Patron Saint, whose transparent integrity and good sense & temperate manners are liked by everyone. Anyway I hv just received a present, 4 volumes of The Story of the Stone: 2,000 pages of sml type. That should keep me occupied for a day or two. Anyone read it?
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Post by Rafwan on Dec 19, 2023 13:32:12 GMT
robbiealive I am just still sore that you suggested a while back that I shouldn’t be posting on this site unless I was trained in Ancient Greek mythology. And now, it seems, eighteenth century Chinese lit, as well! Might I exploit your festive warmth by asking you to indulge my miserable ignorance and tell me who your avatar image is? I tried an internet search of famous Scottish people but there are millions of them and hardly any have piccies.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2023 14:24:54 GMT
Jimjam bemoaned the paucity of vocational diversity amongst candidates of all political parties, not just Labour's. His was a more general observation and concern. Actually I didn't think that was his central point . He wrote :- "I understand the fear of having candidates who might be a tad naive being off message but it is regrettable that we end up with more clone MPs." and "This narrowing phenomenon extends to local Councillors as well with not enough having the experience to challenge officers effectively." I thought he was highlighting the central dilemma in our politics-the tension between Burkean representation-the so-called "trustee" model; and the "delegate model" -essentially party spokesperson. I took his " clone MPs" characterisation to represent the latter of those two models. So jimjam was saying Parties are nervous about the Burkean model of representation. Parties ( all parties) are choosing candidates who wont stray from the party line -which is "narrowing" the diversity of experience . I can believe it given the polarised nature of our politics and the need to support the Manifesto at all costs. ( Though one would have to conclude that the current Tory Party, riven by "independent " factions, has failed dramatically to choose party line parrots ! )
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Post by bardin1 on Dec 19, 2023 14:27:34 GMT
robbiealive I am just still sore that you suggested a while back that I shouldn’t be posting on this site unless I was trained in Ancient Greek mythology. And now, it seems, eighteenth century Chinese lit, as well! Might I exploit your festive warmth by asking you to indulge my miserable ignorance and tell me who your avatar image is? I tried an internet search of famous Scottish people but there are millions of them and hardly any have piccies. Clue: Colonel Kurtz ...and he's not scottish
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Post by wb61 on Dec 19, 2023 14:31:47 GMT
INTERNET INTIMACY & VIRTUAL STOCKHOLM SYNDROME sounds rather seedy: something that would haunt the darker corners of the internet. I certainly don't feel I have an intimate relationship with anyone here!!
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Post by bardin1 on Dec 19, 2023 14:37:55 GMT
INTERNET INTIMACY & VIRTUAL STOCKHOLM SYNDROME sounds rather seedy: something that would haunt the darker corners of the internet. I certainly don't feel I have an intimate relationship with anyone here!! phew!
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Post by Rafwan on Dec 19, 2023 15:45:43 GMT
robbiealive I am just still sore that you suggested a while back that I shouldn’t be posting on this site unless I was trained in Ancient Greek mythology. And now, it seems, eighteenth century Chinese lit, as well! Might I exploit your festive warmth by asking you to indulge my miserable ignorance and tell me who your avatar image is? I tried an internet search of famous Scottish people but there are millions of them and hardly any have piccies. Clue: Colonel Kurtz ...and he's not scottish Another good reason I couldn’t find him. Thanks. I failed eng lit as well (it included Typhoon)
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Post by crossbat11 on Dec 19, 2023 16:18:31 GMT
Jimjam bemoaned the paucity of vocational diversity amongst candidates of all political parties, not just Labour's. His was a more general observation and concern. Actually I didn't think that was his central point . He wrote :- "I understand the fear of having candidates who might be a tad naive being off message but it is regrettable that we end up with more clone MPs." and "This narrowing phenomenon extends to local Councillors as well with not enough having the experience to challenge officers effectively." I thought he was highlighting the central dilemma in our politics-the tension between Burkean representation-the so-called "trustee" model; and the "delegate model" -essentially party spokesperson. I took his " clone MPs" characterisation to represent the latter of those two models. So jimjam was saying Parties are nervous about the Burkean model of representation. Parties ( all parties) are choosing candidates who wont stray from the party line -which is "narrowing" the diversity of experience . I can believe it given the polarised nature of our politics and the need to support the Manifesto at all costs. ( Though one would have to conclude that the current Tory Party, riven by "independent " factions, has failed dramatically to choose party line parrots ! ) My post wasn't a detailed critique of jimjam's post, Colin. That's not really my modus operandi, although I know quite a few posters enjoy line by line microcosmic dissection of other people's posts. His comments though, and you refer to his reference to "clone MPs", did set me off on some thoughts of my own. I freewheeled into other areas, as I often do. Ironically, it was in fact your captain of industry quotation about the lack of vocational business experience amongst Labour candidates that got me thinking more about the subject rather than jimjam. The clone image that jimjam used is obviously a pejorative one and while it may be true on one level, MPs tending to be from a narrow range of vocations and social backgrounds, I don't think purely mixing up the job backgrounds of our elected representatives arrives us at a less cloned arrangement though. I think we must think more deeply about how we get to a more diverse range of abilities in Parliament. Hence what I said in my post which I won't regurgitate here. I'm presuming you've read it already. As for what you've said in your post above, I think you're being unnecessarily negative about party discipline and governments elected on the basis of a manifesto that they have offered to voters. This is how representative democracy and government tends to work but it doesn't have to involve the unwitting lobby fodder and political careerism seen over recent years, does it? Why can't there still be room for independence of thought and integrity while still enabling the government you generally support pass the legislation that they were elected to pass? I'm much more interested in political parties, especially governing parties, being made up of decent human beings who value and respect the responsibilities afforded them. Vocational background and academic/educational attainment clearly is no guarantee of that.
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Post by robbiealive on Dec 19, 2023 16:42:10 GMT
robbiealive I am just still sore that you suggested a while back that I shouldn’t be posting on this site unless I was trained in Ancient Greek mythology. And now, it seems, eighteenth century Chinese lit, as well! Might I exploit your festive warmth by asking you to indulge my miserable ignorance and tell me who your avatar image is? I tried an internet search of famous Scottish people but there are millions of them and hardly any have piccies. 1. I regret I too know nothing about Greek mythology, so useful in a quiz. As you joined in 02.23 & I havnt been on since 10.22 it cannot have been me who chastised you, leaving aside my mild approach. 2, It's Conrad. My favourite novelist. I recommend Nostromo a masterpiece The central character in Typhoon is Capt McWhirr, the utterly unimaginative Captain of the ship that enters the storm. His stolidness leads him to ignore the typhoon warnings but allows him to remain calm in the tempest and solve the problem of how to reconcile the Chinese coolies -- the freight on the ship -- whose individual hoards of silver dollars earned with such hardship have been mixed together in the fury. He divides them equally between them! & the spare ones go the most injured. Conrad alternates with Alain Fournier, the author of Le Grand Meaulnes. Bardini1 on here has, or had, a 1st edition of the latter, signed by Fournier. I think it was £20 thou. I used to use Orwell but was told off by Laszlo .3. The debate is academic becuase it deals with ideal types not the reality of the rough house of the political process. I would prefer to look at the results and work backwards. Most Tory MPs are chosen by narrow-minded Tory members who, as Orwell said of the rulers of the Soviet regime in the '30s, choose people exactly like themselves. Brexiteers etc. Johnson purged the Tory party of centrist MPs. They were dumped by their constituency parties. I wonder how much diversity & indeed talent was represented by the replacements! Many of the right-wing Brexiteers rebel, something which the Associations, once censorious of rebellion, now tolerate? Endorse? Sunak has slowly learned the lesson of every Tory PM since Major: no matter how much you appease the nutjobs, they are never satisfied. To get the kind of vocational diversity which JimJam recommends would require central coordination of candidate choice. At the moment the main coordination is to exclude Corbynites. Both sides seem a long way from a balance of ideal types. 4. It's 5 vols. The last one has just arrived.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2023 16:43:59 GMT
My post wasn't a detailed critique of jimjam's post, Colin. That's not really my modus operandi, although I know quite a few posters enjoy line by line microcosmic dissection of other people's posts. His comments though, and you refer to his reference to "clone MPs", did set me off on some thoughts of my own. I freewheeled into other areas, as I often do. Ironically, it was in fact your captain of industry quotation about the lack of vocational business experience amongst Labour candidates that got me thinking more about the subject rather than jimjam. The clone image that jimjam used is obviously a pejorative one and while it may be true on one level, MPs tending to be from a narrow range of vocations and social backgrounds, I don't think purely mixing up the job backgrounds of our elected representatives arrives us at a less cloned arrangement though. I think we must think more deeply about how we get to a more diverse range of abilities in Parliament. Hence what I said in my post which I won't regurgitate here. I'm presuming you've read it already. As for what you've said in your post above, I think you're being unnecessarily negative about party discipline and governments elected on the basis of a manifesto that they have offered to voters. This is how representative democracy and government tends to work but it doesn't have to involve the unwitting lobby fodder and political careerism seen over recent years, does it? Why can't there still be room for independence of thought and integrity while still enabling the government you generally support pass the legislation that they were elected to pass? I'm much more interested in political parties, especially governing parties, being made up of decent human beings who value and respect the responsibilities afforded them. Vocational background and academic/educational attainment clearly is no guarantee of that. Nor was mine crossbat-just offering a different view of what jim jam was driving at, based on what he wrote. Which I think did touch on a systemic dilemma. Hence my thoughts. I agree that "representative democracy and government doesn't have to involve the unwitting lobby fodder and political careerism seen over recent years," as you put it. But jim jam indicates that in his experience the selection process tends to produce it -and with it a narrowing of experience . Yes I agree that " governing parties, being made up of decent human beings who value and respect the responsibilities afforded them." is eminently desirable.
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steve
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Post by steve on Dec 19, 2023 17:02:47 GMT
The ghost of Christmas farce!
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steve
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Post by steve on Dec 19, 2023 17:22:19 GMT
Liar liar short trousers on fire
"Sunak rebuked by UK's statistics watchdog for making misleading claim about government debt falling"
Rishi Sunak has been rebuked by the UK’s statistics watchdog for making misleading claims about his record on bringing down government debt.
Sunak has made reducing the national debt one of his five priorities, and in a video posted on X after the autumn statement he said “debt is falling”. Later in November he told MPs at PMQs “we have indeed reduced debt”.
Sarah Olney, a corporate accountant before becoming an mp, the Lib Dem’s Treasury spokesperson, wrote to the UK Statistics Authority to ask if there was any justification for what Sunak was saying and today, in a response, the authority’s chair, Sir Robert Chote, said Sunak’s words were misleading.
Chote said No 10 tried to justify Sunak’s “is falling” comment by saying he was referring to what was forecast to happen in 2028. Chote explained:
In this instance, the prime minister’s office informed us that both claims referred to the fact that the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) was forecasting that the underlying measure of net debt (excluding the Bank) would be falling as a proportion of GDP (although not in cash terms) in the final year of its five-year forecast, in line with the government’s target …
The average person in the street would probably not have interpreted the prime minister’s claims in the way that his office explained them to us and would likely have assumed that he was claiming that debt was already falling"
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Dec 19, 2023 17:27:15 GMT
Note that, adjusting for inflation, funding has been cut by £525 million since 2014-2015. However when more or less went into this they concluded a significant factor was growing demand, because of growing numbers of older people.
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Post by lefthanging on Dec 19, 2023 17:59:29 GMT
"Sarah Olney, a corporate accountant before becoming an mp, the Lib Dem’s Treasury spokesperson, wrote to the UK Statistics Authority to ask if there was any justification for what Sunak was saying and today, in a response, the authority’s chair, Sir Robert Chote, said Sunak’s words were misleading. Chote said No 10 tried to justify Sunak’s “is falling” comment by saying he was referring to what was forecast to happen in 2028. Chote explained: In this instance, the prime minister’s office informed us that both claims referred to the fact that the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) was forecasting that the underlying measure of net debt (excluding the Bank) would be falling as a proportion of GDP (although not in cash terms) in the final year of its five-year forecast, in line with the government’s target … The average person in the street would probably not have interpreted the prime minister’s claims in the way that his office explained them to us and would likely have assumed that he was claiming that debt was already falling" And Robert Chote would know - he used to head up the OBR!
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Post by lefthanging on Dec 19, 2023 18:04:38 GMT
Not sure if this has been commented on but does anyone think the fact that even the Government is now backing a so-called 'sustainable ceasefire' - with increasing pressure to back an 'immediate ceasefire' and the international community getting more and more concerned about Israel's conduct - suggest it was a mistake for Starmer to whip his MPs to vote against it?
And is it Labour's reluctance on this issue which created the space for the Government to back the halfway house of a sustainable ceasefire in the first place?
For my money it was probably a small mistake but not likely to make much difference either way.
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Post by hireton on Dec 19, 2023 18:24:14 GMT
It's a bold political strategy to major on an issue which the public rates you so low on:
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Post by Rafwan on Dec 19, 2023 18:41:31 GMT
Thanks, robbiealive, much appreciated. Your synopsis brought back long-lost memories of Captain McWhirr. My O level failure brings me continuing shame and regret. I blamed the teachers, but really it was my own indolence and lack of application (as my mother repeatedly told me). I have calculated that I cannot be among your eight OCDs and that is a great relief to me. My obscure ramblings about mythology could easily have been symptomatic.
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