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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2023 16:15:00 GMT
Well if I see a certain lady in church tonight I shall be able to say 'Rejoice at that news!' '¡Alégrate con esa noticia!' surely |
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Mr Poppy
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Post by Mr Poppy on Aug 20, 2023 16:28:58 GMT
Might be a few from UKPR2 who will attend 'Glee Club' this year but for the 90%+ who are ABLDEM then I'll summarise their 'deniable'* policies: A/ Do whatever Starmer asks if Starmer will let us join a LAB HMG B/ If Starmer doesn't want us or A fails for any other reason then do whatever CON ask if they'll us join a CON HMG Still I expect that a bit like UKPR2 then it's nice for people to talk about very fine detail of policies (like a graduate tax versus the current system which is basically a graduate tax anyway) safe in the knowledge that they won't be the organ grinders in any future HMG. Nice to meet up for a sing along through I suppose - if 'Glee Club' is your thing. www.libdems.org.uk/conference/papers/autumn-2023* 'Thick as Vince' covers option A/ and see earlier for ways that Davey+co. could be Starmer's 'useful idiots' (especially if the SCG faction of LAB deny RW-LAB a Red Tory OM) PS and a reminder from into GE'19 when LDEM were even prepared to do a pact with a NAT. So if they say they'd never do a pact with SNP then treat that with a bucket of salt.
Lib Dems, Greens and Plaid Cymru reveal remain election pactwww.theguardian.com/politics/2019/nov/07/lib-dems-greens-and-plaid-cymru-reveal-remain-election-pact |
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Mr Poppy
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Post by Mr Poppy on Aug 20, 2023 16:33:01 GMT
Photo-shopping your own photos after forgetting to put an England shirt on for the original. Embarrassing 🤦♂️ PS He does look good in Tory Blue though and did remember the beer prop (even Rishi remembers to include that and he doesn't even drink)  |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2023 16:43:35 GMT
Woke Wars in the Green Party ! Whatever next :-
"The former deputy leader of the Greens has described the party as an “oppressive space for free speech” before a landmark trial on Monday at which he will allege discrimination on account of his “gender-critical” beliefs.
Shahrar Ali, 54, is set to face down his colleagues in the first known civil trial of its kind — in which a political party member is taking on their own party to defend their right to free speech in the gender debate.
Ali will allege that he faced discrimination, hostility and victimisation when he was sacked from his position as policing and domestic safety spokesman owing to his views on gender — which are protected beliefs under the 2010 Equality Act.
Ali claims the case is “a battle for the soul of the Green Party”, adding: “It has completely lost its way. It has become an oppressive space for free speech.”
Two other Green members are also taking legal action against the party over alleged discrimination due to their views on gender."
ST
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2023 16:49:28 GMT
Old habits die hard !
"Germany is debating whether to ban the far-Right Alternative for Germany (AfD) as the party surges to 21 per cent in the polls, amid warnings from intelligence officials that its members are becoming increasingly extreme.
Frank-Walter Steinmeier, the German president, warned in a speech to the country’s domestic intelligence agency that “we all have it in our hands to put those who despise our democracy in their place”.
DT
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Post by alec on Aug 20, 2023 16:50:07 GMT
pete - "Wasn't there some nasal spray that stopped Covid/made it weaker?" Yes there was. Enovid underwent some clinical trials and performed quite well, but isn't available in the UK. Boots Dual Defence has been independently tested with good results, although this wasn't a formal clinical trial. That is a spray originating from seaweed, and is it claimed to form a sticky lining that traps the Sars-Cov2 virus and prevents it accessing the ACE2 receptors. These preventative treatments are based on physical barriers, so should be variant proof. There has also been a very recent paper reporting on a nasal spray adenovirus vector vaccine that performed very well in stage 3 clinical trials. As with most of these innovations, it's non western nations leading the way, and this one was from Bharat Pharma in India. They reported much higher levels of neutralizing mucosal membrane antibodies than with the jab vaccine, with this protection lasting for 8 months I recall. Elsewhere, researchers have identified something like 28 different potential sites on the Sar-Cov2 virus to target for pan-variant vaccines, which don't target the spike protein which is so prone to mutation, and which could in theory give us a vaccine that meets any variant. But as with the nasal sprays, nasal vaccines and second generation pan variant vaccines, most governments have given up, so the development of these is just so much slower. I suspect we'll see a change of tone fairly quickly thought. The new BA.2.86 is ringing all manner of alarm bells, and could well signal the end of the Omicron era. At some point, voters and the government's they elect will get tired of constant reinfection, and as clinicians (including the CDC in the US) are starting to warn that they are seeing more adverse reactions to third and fourth infections, I think we'll see a return to a bit more urgency regarding the need to address the covid crisis. There are some significant
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Mr Poppy
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Post by Mr Poppy on Aug 20, 2023 16:51:41 GMT
Woke Wars in the Green Party ! Whatever next :- "The former deputy leader of the Greens has described the party as an “oppressive space for free speech” before a landmark trial on Monday at which he will allege discrimination on account of his “gender-critical” beliefs. Shahrar Ali, 54, is set to face down his colleagues in the first known civil trial of its kind — in which a political party member is taking on their own party to defend their right to free speech in the gender debate. Ali will allege that he faced discrimination, hostility and victimisation when he was sacked from his position as policing and domestic safety spokesman owing to his views on gender — which are protected beliefs under the 2010 Equality Act. Ali claims the case is “a battle for the soul of the Green Party”, adding: “It has completely lost its way. It has become an oppressive space for free speech.” Two other Green members are also taking legal action against the party over alleged discrimination due to their views on gender." ST The 'war on woke' always felt like a 'civil' war to me  Although surely everyone knew that Mermaids don't have legs (so couldn't have 'standing')? Apparently not... |
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pjw1961
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Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state, an intolerable one.
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Post by pjw1961 on Aug 20, 2023 17:08:48 GMT
"The Far-Left (Corbynite/ista, xLW-LAB, etc) are making it very clear that Starmer is not Corbyn" Looking at the polls it seems the public have noticed that as well!  |
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domjg
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Post by domjg on Aug 20, 2023 17:13:33 GMT
Old habits die hard ! "Germany is debating whether to ban the far-Right Alternative for Germany (AfD) as the party surges to 21 per cent in the polls, amid warnings from intelligence officials that its members are becoming increasingly extreme. Frank-Walter Steinmeier, the German president, warned in a speech to the country’s domestic intelligence agency that “we all have it in our hands to put those who despise our democracy in their place”. DT There has been debate about whether the AfD is 'Verfassungswidrig' more or less sense it came about. That's the nature of having a system adjudicated by a constitutional court. They're really only a major threat in the east. As I've mentioned before I don't think unification should have taken place certainly not when it did. It just gave many east Germans an easy narrative of thoughtless grievance. For clarification the debate on whether to declare them anti-constitution has far less to do with their ratings and far more to do with the increasing extremism of some of their pronouncements. |
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 20, 2023 17:16:13 GMT
Trevor go to source, Rachael Swindon aka Rachael Cousins as mentioned before Ms Cousins is a Corbyn " super fan" who runs a Corbyn Twitter factory of somewhat dubious provenance whose primary aim appears to be the undermining of the current Labour leadership and just about anyone else who she perceives as remotely critical of Mr Corbyn.
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 20, 2023 17:27:12 GMT
Trevor
Desperate stuff from you.
The photos of Ed Davey both come from his Twitter feed they appear there precisely as you have shown them one above the other, posted by Davey like that , you have to be a special kind of person to try to perceive this as some form of deception.
Yes the England shirt has been superimposed on the top image it's a show of support for the team.
It comes from the last game not this by the way.
I suspect Davey is quite capable of buying a pint in his local and probably wouldn't be caught pretending to be paying for fuel for a borrowed car in a petrol station with a can of coke.
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domjg
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Post by domjg on Aug 20, 2023 17:52:17 GMT
The Netherlands and Denmark leading the way on support for Ukraine by agreeing to supply 42 and 19 F-16s respectively. The barriers fall eventually, I just wish they'd fall sooner. I can only hope that somewhere someone has decided there's actually method in this drawn out incrementalism.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2023 18:05:19 GMT
The Netherlands and Denmark leading the way on support for Ukraine by agreeing to supply 42 and 19 F-16s respectively. The barriers fall eventually, I just wish they'd fall sooner. I can only hope that somewhere someone has decided there's actually method in this drawn out incrementalism. The method is : Keep Ukraine in one piece without having to confront Russia Ourselves. It's a disastrous failure. |
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Post by mercian on Aug 20, 2023 18:18:43 GMT
Am I misremembering? Wasn't there some nasal spray that stopped Covid/made it weaker? For God's sake don't encourage them. 🤣 They can write whole books on just that one point! |
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Post by leftieliberal on Aug 20, 2023 18:40:26 GMT
You're turning into jib now Mr Poppy There is a world of difference between a pact with the Greens, and Plaid Cymru and a pact with the SNP. In Wales it was specifically to save Brecon and Radnor (although it failed in that) after the Lib Dems won it in the by-election. if it were not for FPTP we would not need pacts with other parties. |
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Post by James E on Aug 20, 2023 19:01:22 GMT
We will eventually rejoin for exactly the same reason we did the first time - the British economy desperately needs the EU markets. The advantage over 1/1/1973 may be that next time we will fully understand what we are joining. Not sure how long this will take - I suspect a lengthy period of growing alignment followed by it happening very quickly as the current generation of politicians disappear off the stage with their baggage. We will of course need to sign up to everything. Opinion has shifted steadily over the past two years, to the point that we now have a clear 60/40 majority (on average) in favour of rejoining. www.whatukthinks.org/eu/opinion-polls/poll-of-polls-uk-eu/There has not been a 60/40 majority either way for a decade, and back in 2013 it was the Leave side which had such a lead. And the Rejoin side is clearly winning the battle of hearts and minds among the electorate of the future. Using YouGov's most recent poll, while over 65s divide 36/64 for 'Stay out' (so exactly as they voted in the 2016 Referendum, those under 65 are 72/28 in favour of 'Rejoin'. That's a 20% swing since 2016, when they voted 52/28 for Remain. docs.cdn.yougov.com/7myo59zisk/Internal_Brexit_230809_W.pdfyougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2016/06/27/how-britain-voted |
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 20, 2023 19:10:04 GMT
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Post by crossbat11 on Aug 20, 2023 19:17:29 GMT
Ladies and Gentlemen, I can announce that the 2023/24 English Premier League football season officially started today.
And what a start it was for the Villa too. Off to a flier.
We're Aston Villa and we're taking the pi....
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Mr Poppy
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Teaching assistant and now your elected PM
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Post by Mr Poppy on Aug 20, 2023 19:42:35 GMT
You're turning into jib now Mr Poppy There is a world of difference between a pact with the Greens, and Plaid Cymru and a pact with the SNP. In Wales it was specifically to save Brecon and Radnor (although it failed in that) after the Lib Dems won it in the by-election. if it were not for FPTP we would not need pacts with other parties. Thankfully due to FPTP then it will be unlikely that anyone needs to do a pact with "you"I'm not sure why I left you on for notifications* but I expect back before 2010 a lot of LDEM folks thought LDEM would never do a post-election pact with CON - but they did. I appreciate as a member of 'Glee Club' you'll be biased to your own party but there is no denying the truth - LDEM agreed a PRE-election pact with a NAT, so it is possible they would do a POST-election pact with another NAT. Obviously as a BNAT in Scotland, where LDEM win a few seats as 'best placed ABSNP', they won't say that BEFORE they 'put country first' or whatever other excuse they use to get a few red briefcases and ministerial cars but don't expect those outwith your own party to be so naive as those who wish to be "fooled twice".* A mistake I'll now correct. PS "Uno I Aros" (as they say in Welsh) was also designed to help Plaid Cymru keep/win several seats (eg Ynys Môn, or Anglesey as most people would probably call it). CON ended up winning Anglesey with LDEM ending up in their usual role of Tory enablers keeping out a 'progressive-socialist' party (Corbyn-LAB). Not that Boris needed a few extra seats in Wales but 'Ta muchly' to LDEM for their help in GE'19 en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unite_to_Remain#List_of_constituencies |
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Aug 20, 2023 20:00:08 GMT
Elsewhere, researchers have identified something like 28 different potential sites on the Sar-Cov2 virus to target for pan-variant vaccines, which don't target the spike protein which is so prone to mutation, and which could in theory give us a vaccine that meets any variant. But as with the nasal sprays, nasal vaccines and second generation pan variant vaccines, most governments have given up, so the development of these is just so much slower. Its funny, but we were told the reason why the vaccines targeted the spike protein was because it could not be varied. And yet here we are, it did vary. Traditional deactivated whole virus vaccines are considered to be more effective against variants exactly because they are the entire virus, and antibodies will be created against any opportunistic target areas. Its the same reason why your own antibodies after catching covid will be more effective against variants than if you had a vaccination. At least, the sort of vaccination the western world's pharmaceutical companies decided to go for. And thats curious too, because there were very many candiates, but most ended up the same sort. I seem to remember either Russia or China went the traditional route? We have had two years of constant circulating covid, instead of the surges and then hardly anything which is the natural pattern and happened in 2020. Is that really good news, that instead of a short sharp outbreak we created a perpetual one?
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Post by hireton on Aug 20, 2023 20:01:28 GMT
I always read him as opposed to Brexit. Norway+ was my preferred outcome, but accept any Brexit was preferable to no Brexit. We will gradually move to that position, but any idea of rejoin as the UK is for the birds. You oppose freedom of movement. Norway+ ( indeed Norway) includes FoM. Are you really that ill-informed? |
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pjw1961
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Post by pjw1961 on Aug 20, 2023 20:09:36 GMT
Hi leftieliberal welcome to the club. We might need to hire a larger clubhouse soon.
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domjg
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Post by domjg on Aug 20, 2023 20:09:47 GMT
colin ‘ Old habits die hard !’ - That’s more than a bit offensive as we get the base insinuation. In constantly checking that parties and organisations in public life fit with the constitution actually it is an old habit. One that’s been practised since 1951 when the constitutional court (Bundesverfassungsgericht) was founded. In Germany the constitution is the political holy of holies. It’s sacrosanct and everyone understands that it guarantees the rights of German citizens and underpins their democracy. Anything that seeks or appears to seek to overturn the democratic rules based order could be ruled unconstitutional by the court. It means that Germany is far better armed to defend against attacks on it’s democracy than we are. Far more robust.
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oldnat
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Extremist - Undermining the UK state and its institutions
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Post by oldnat on Aug 20, 2023 20:09:52 GMT
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Mr Poppy
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Post by Mr Poppy on Aug 20, 2023 20:14:05 GMT
Norway+ was my preferred outcome, but accept any Brexit was preferable to no Brexit. We will gradually move to that position, but any idea of rejoin as the UK is for the birds. You oppose freedom of movement. Norway+ ( indeed Norway) includes FoM. Are you really that ill-informed? The '+' and '-' signs were never given hard and fast rules/details on what they stood for. It is quite possible that jib considers the '+' in Norway+ to be what I described as Norway- It would be a +ve to not sign up to paying in ££billions or bringing back 'purple passports' IMO, although given that is 'less' then I use '-' If you have a source* that spelled out what all the '+' (or '-') were supposed to mean then by all means post the info to help 'inform' the rest of us about something few people are interested in that happened some time ago now. TBC how the UK-EU nations and UK-EC/EU relationships evolve in the future but it is for those who want a significantly different agreement to the current arrangement to state what they want, put their desired option into a GE manifesto, get elected with a mandate to ask for what they want, etc. PS As well as my other 'perhaps' options then one more would be a sector specific trade war at a more convenient time that meant we move to a 'more distant'** relationship with EC-EU (my preference). Not that important to me anymore but an opportunity to do so might present itself at some point in the future. * EG Barnier's infamous staircase where perhaps there was a 'secret' slide that showed even more steps than the 'a la carte' options that MPs via all the 'Indicative Votes' in HoC '17-19 turned down - before Boris became PM and baked our own 'oven ready' dish for voters to chose (or not) in GE'19. IIRC then in the Final Say then voters picked Boris's 'oven ready' deal (for GB, with dishy Rishi tidying up the NI issue later). ** Another 'woolly' term once used by polling companies back in the day when folks were interested in people's views on what kind of relationship we should have. |
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oldnat
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Extremist - Undermining the UK state and its institutions
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Post by oldnat on Aug 20, 2023 20:19:16 GMT
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Mr Poppy
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Post by Mr Poppy on Aug 20, 2023 20:29:19 GMT
We will eventually rejoin for exactly the same reason we did the first time - the British economy desperately needs the EU markets. The advantage over 1/1/ 1973 may be that next time we will fully understand what we are joining. Not sure how long this will take - I suspect a lengthy period of growing alignment followed by it happening very quickly as the current generation of politicians disappear off the stage with their baggage. We will of course need to sign up to everything. Opinion has shitfed steadily over the past two years, to the point that we now have a clear 60/40 majority (on average) in favour of rejoining. www.whatukthinks.org/eu/opinion-polls/poll-of-polls-uk-eu/There has not been a 60/40 majority either way for a decade, and back in 2013 it was the Leave side which had such a lead. And the Rejoin side is clearly winning the battle of hearts and minds among the electorate of the future. Using YouGov's most recent poll, while over 65s divide 36/64 for 'Stay out' (so exactly as they voted in the 2016 Referendum, those under 65 are 72/28 in favour of 'Rejoin'. That's a 20% swing since 2016, when they voted 52/28 for Remain. docs.cdn.yougov.com/7myo59zisk/Internal_Brexit_230809_W.pdfyougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2016/06/27/how-britain-votedThe World has moved on a bit since the 1970s (although perhaps some people haven't noticed stuff like the internet?) The EU didn't even exist in the 1970s but if it turns it back on 'ever closer union' then PERHAPS it might go back to what it was when we joined the EEC. If anyone wants to campaign to join the Euro and 'full fat' EU membership then why wait - Gina Miller is waiting for your vote! The longer we are out then the more supply chains will have adjusted; the harder it would be to join something that has become an even closer union; and the more 'sovereignty' we'd need to give up to do so. 'Tick tock' as we/they used to say back in the day (or just 'Carry on Moaning')  For those speaking in terms of certainty than any chance of some tips for the 14:05 at Brighton tomorrow? www.racingpost.com |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2023 20:53:41 GMT
Should repair readily enough. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2023 20:54:14 GMT
Norway+ was my preferred outcome, but accept any Brexit was preferable to no Brexit. We will gradually move to that position, but any idea of rejoin as the UK is for the birds. You oppose freedom of movement. Norway+ ( indeed Norway) includes FoM. Are you really that ill-informed? Yes. |
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Post by mercian on Aug 20, 2023 20:56:28 GMT
Elsewhere, researchers have identified something like 28 different potential sites on the Sar-Cov2 virus to target for pan-variant vaccines, which don't target the spike protein which is so prone to mutation, and which could in theory give us a vaccine that meets any variant. But as with the nasal sprays, nasal vaccines and second generation pan variant vaccines, most governments have given up, so the development of these is just so much slower. Its funny, but we were told the reason why the vaccines targeted the spike protein was because it could not be varied. And yet here we are, it did vary. ...
Oh God. 🙄 There are two subjects that people bang on and on about here. One is Brexit and even though most voters aren't interested any more at least it's to do with politics. Covid isn't. There are bursts of posts about other irrelevant things of course, such as the Ladies Footer, but they are short lived. This Covid crap has been going on for YEARS. |
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