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Post by johntel on Aug 20, 2023 7:37:17 GMT
I don't remember Labour or any other party making a fuss about confirmatory referendums before the event - they were all convinced Remain would win and thought that admitting the possibility it might not would boost the Brexit vote - so I don't think it's fair to blame Cameron and Clegg. I think it’s fair and I think it’s naive/ blinkered to think otherwise for reasons that are self-evident. And I think Forest will win the league this year for reasons that are self-evident.
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Post by crossbat11 on Aug 20, 2023 7:40:43 GMT
I think it’s fair and I think it’s naive/ blinkered to think otherwise for reasons that are self-evident. And I think Forest will win the league this year for reasons that are self-evident. Those reasons being that you're a Forest fan. I have similar reasons for my unshakeable belief in Villa's prospects this season too. Being a lifelong Villa fan, that is.
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Post by crossbat11 on Aug 20, 2023 7:56:29 GMT
I happened upon this interesting article by Peter Hain in today's Observer. It's a reminder of the late Sir Michael Parkinson's radical political roots. It's easy to forget them when you consider Parkinson's long celebrity-laden life in television and his association with a lot of its glitz and superficial glamour, but he was a miner's son with socialist beliefs. These may have faded over time but were never fully extinguished. In this article, Hain pays tribute to Parkinson's long association with, and support for, the anti-apartheid movement in Britain. He campaigned vigorously against the South African regime, particularly during the D'Oliveira affair in 1968, while writing for the Times and other journals. This didn't make him at all popular with the British and cricketing establishment at the time. John Arlott was another who received similar opprobrium. This important part of Parkinson's life has been largely and unsurprisingly ignored in the tributes paid to him in the mainstream media this week, but it is an essential part of who he was and the contribution he made to public life, particularly as a very fine journalist. www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/aug/20/michael-parkinson-peter-hain-anti-apartheid-south-africa-cricket-tour P.S. I was both surprised and amused to discover in Hain's article that Brian Clough was a founder sponsor of the Anti-Nazi League in 1977. No wonder the men in suits at the FA never gave him the England job!!
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Aug 20, 2023 8:05:28 GMT
And I think Forest will win the league this year for reasons that are self-evident. Those reasons being that you're a Forest fan. I have similar reasons for my unshakeable belief in Villa's prospects this season too. Being a lifelong Villa fan, that is. Unfortunately I think Wolves will be relegated this season 😞
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c-a-r-f-r-e-w
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A step on the way toward the demise of the liberal elite? Or just a blip…
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Aug 20, 2023 8:06:08 GMT
Organic coffee at the ready, women’s footie final kicks off in an hour, not a bad way to ease into a Sunday…
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Post by crossbat11 on Aug 20, 2023 8:11:11 GMT
Organic coffee at the ready, women’s footie final kicks off in an hour, not a bad way to ease into a Sunday… Steady, Carfers. Don't peak too early. Kick off is 11.00am UK time!!
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Post by crossbat11 on Aug 20, 2023 8:16:32 GMT
Those reasons being that you're a Forest fan. I have similar reasons for my unshakeable belief in Villa's prospects this season too. Being a lifelong Villa fan, that is. Unfortunately I think Wolves will be relegated this season 😞 They played well at Man U last weekend and were very unlucky not to get at least a point. Don't know what happened against Brighton yesterday though. Wolves defeat lifted Villa off bottom place on alphabetical order!!
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c-a-r-f-r-e-w
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A step on the way toward the demise of the liberal elite? Or just a blip…
Posts: 6,680
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Aug 20, 2023 8:17:26 GMT
Organic coffee at the ready, women’s footie final kicks off in an hour, not a bad way to ease into a Sunday… Steady, Carfers. Don't peak too early. Kick off is 11.00am UK time!! oh, Reuters said it was 10am. Thanks for the heads up. (I shall do some exercises for the tibialis anterior in the meantime then. Then work on the the novel pawn to a1 gambit)
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 20, 2023 8:33:14 GMT
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Aug 20, 2023 8:43:07 GMT
Unfortunately I think Wolves will be relegated this season 😞 They played well at Man U last weekend and were very unlucky not to get at least a point. Don't know what happened against Brighton yesterday though. Wolves defeat lifted Villa off bottom place on alphabetical order!! Yes they did deserve something at United They played okay for some of the game yesterday, but it was the usual problem for Wolves, the finishing touch Our last manager left a few days before the season started, I really rated him. Wolves had sold some of their best players and didn't replace them. We struggled last season in finishing and think Lopetegui could see the writing on the wall with a clear steer the owners didn't want to open their cheque book
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Post by jib on Aug 20, 2023 8:44:00 GMT
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 20, 2023 9:15:43 GMT
As usual little boy blue jumps in with his memory box that stopped in May 2015 Let's put aside that it wasn't my party in 2012(11 years ago) but as usual as you are a blatant Tory apologist you ignore the fact that 80% of that government consisted of tories and the Secretary of state for education at the time was Michael Gove and the minister for sport was Hugh Robertson, both Tories. Or indeed that the fall in sports funding commenced in 2009 when the coalition wasn't in office. If you actually bothered to read the article you referenced the cut in funding wasn't actually as black and white as all that anyway however Tory led governments historically have a poor history of school sport funding and provision no argument there. Go back and play with your crayons.
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 20, 2023 9:21:56 GMT
"Is having a brass neck a pre resquisite for membership of your party?"
Is being utterly devoid of contact with reality a pre requisite of whatever fringe delusional brexitanian cult you support. Your posts suggest probably UKIP.
Perhaps I can make this clear in as few syllables as possible so one of our contributors can try to grasp it.
If there was any chance of the lib dems backing a Tory government again I would resign my membership immediately. I wouldn't support or offer my vote to any party that did. But there isn't a problem so I don't have to worry about it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2023 9:30:36 GMT
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 20, 2023 9:31:35 GMT
“It is no secret that some Labour and Green party voters lent us their votes in Somerset and we are very grateful for their support,” he said. “In many seats across the south-west, voters at the next election will be faced with a similar choice between the Liberal Democrats and the Conservatives.
“My message to all voters who want to get rid of this out-of-touch Conservative government is clear: if the Liberal Democrats can win back our heartlands in the West Country, it could lock the Conservatives out of power for a generation.”
Ed Davey July 2023
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Post by jib on Aug 20, 2023 9:47:57 GMT
As usual little boy blue jumps in with his memory box that stopped in May 2015 Let's put aside that it wasn't my party in 2012(11 years ago) but as usual as you are a blatant Tory apologist you ignore the fact that 80% of that government consisted of tories and the Secretary of state for education at the time was Michael Gove and the minister for sport was Hugh Robertson, both Tories. Or indeed that the fall in sports funding commenced in 2009 when the coalition wasn't in office. If you actually bothered to read the article you referenced the cut in funding wasn't actually as black and white as all that anyway however Tory led governments historically have a poor history of school sport funding and provision no argument there. Go back and play with your crayons. Look, I've found the perfect footwear for you to wear to your next party event. P.S. Don't call or infer me to be a Tory - you're the member of the enabler party. Right at home too. . #toryenablers
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2023 9:50:28 GMT
This is the most important invention of 20C.
" It consumes 3–5% of the world's natural gas production (around 1–2% of the world's energy supply).
It causes 3% of global carbon emissions,
Nearly 50% of the nitrogen found in human tissues originated from the Haber–Bosch process. Thus, the Haber process serves as the "detonator of the population explosion", enabling the global population to increase from 1.6 billion in 1900 to 7.7 billion by November 2018." (1)
Without it we could not feed half the global population.(2)
(1)https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haber_process
(2)https://www.nature.com/articles/22672#:~:text=But%20the%20world's%20population%20could,for%20tissue%20growth%20and%20maintenance.
In todays ST , Ed Conway writes that UK ( CF Fertilisers) &( Europe ( BASF ) have closed their Haber-Bosch plants because of gas prices.
The fields of Europe will be fertilised with nitrogen from Saudi & USA
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Aug 20, 2023 9:57:47 GMT
As usual little boy blue jumps in with his memory box that stopped in May 2015 Let's put aside that it wasn't my party in 2012(11 years ago) but as usual as you are a blatant Tory apologist you ignore the fact that 80% of that government consisted of tories But libs had a 100% veto on preventing them forming a stable government. They didnt use it.
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domjg
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Post by domjg on Aug 20, 2023 9:57:57 GMT
More of the 'we screwed ourselves over but now let's just live with it' attitude. That seems to be all brexiters have left these days (except jib who still pretends it's going great). No, we will not live with it. Rejoin may be a long way off, but gradual realignment leading back to the single market and free movement is a game that is most definitely on in the years to come.
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Mr Poppy
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Teaching assistant and now your elected PM
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Post by Mr Poppy on Aug 20, 2023 10:01:50 GMT
Mr Poppy The League of Empire Loyalists lasted from 1954-1967. If we assume that the League of EU Loyalists started in 2016, they should have run out of steam by 2029, just in time for the next-but-one GE Roman Empire lasted a long time, Holy Roman Empire even longer. Napoleon and Hitler not so long (or so many countries). I wouldn't like to predict how long this one will last but the 'economic divergence' is clear to see (although currently somewhat obscured by the golden €€ leaves that fell from the Magic Money Trees that EU and ECB have now chopped down) Timing of Brexit, just after one EU crisis and an 'Annus horribilis' for them, was pretty handy though UK might have sticking plasters on various policies but EU are in a different league when it comes to 'muddling through' but given I'm surprised the 'project' has lasted this long then I'll avoid a prediction of when it will break-up (or perhaps go back to being no more than a 'FREE' trade agreement - in which case I wouldn't be opposed to rejoining).
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Post by graham on Aug 20, 2023 10:11:52 GMT
As usual little boy blue jumps in with his memory box that stopped in May 2015 Let's put aside that it wasn't my party in 2012(11 years ago) but as usual as you are a blatant Tory apologist you ignore the fact that 80% of that government consisted of tories and the Secretary of state for education at the time was Michael Gove and the minister for sport was Hugh Robertson, both Tories. Or indeed that the fall in sports funding commenced in 2009 when the coalition wasn't in office. If you actually bothered to read the article you referenced the cut in funding wasn't actually as black and white as all that anyway however Tory led governments historically have a poor history of school sport funding and provision no argument there. Go back and play with your crayons. The point is though that the LDs could have brought that Government to an end at any time. They chose not to do so.
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Mr Poppy
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Teaching assistant and now your elected PM
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Post by Mr Poppy on Aug 20, 2023 10:51:11 GMT
Look, I've found the perfect footwear for you to wear to your next party event. P.S. Don't call or infer me to be a Tory - you're the member of the enabler party. Right at home too. . #toryenablersLDEM folks these days might prefer the Red Tory Enabler ones. Flip flops for flip floppers.
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c-a-r-f-r-e-w
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A step on the way toward the demise of the liberal elite? Or just a blip…
Posts: 6,680
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Aug 20, 2023 10:53:51 GMT
This is the most important invention of 20C. " It consumes 3–5% of the world's natural gas production (around 1–2% of the world's energy supply). It causes 3% of global carbon emissions, Nearly 50% of the nitrogen found in human tissues originated from the Haber–Bosch process. Thus, the Haber process serves as the "detonator of the population explosion", enabling the global population to increase from 1.6 billion in 1900 to 7.7 billion by November 2018." (1) Without it we could not feed half the global population.(2) (1)https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haber_process (2)https://www.nature.com/articles/22672#:~:text=But%20the%20world's%20population%20could,for%20tissue%20growth%20and%20maintenance. In todays ST , Ed Conway writes that UK ( CF Fertilisers) &( Europe ( BASF ) have closed their Haber-Bosch plants because of gas prices. The fields of Europe will be fertilised with nitrogen from Saudi & USA Out of interest Col, we are apparently opening a mine for an alternative source of fertiliser that’s natural, low CO2, has a number of benefits etc. m.youtube.com/watch?v=22dIkWYUAxQMight not address the global scale, but still, looks pretty handy…
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Mr Poppy
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Teaching assistant and now your elected PM
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Post by Mr Poppy on Aug 20, 2023 10:57:23 GMT
Speaking of romanticising (or irrelevant drivel that ignores facts like Italy (part of EU) having totally lost control of immigration) then the Groan are pumping out the 'Brexit is a bit shit' stories still: www.theguardian.com/business/2023/aug/20/politicians-can-always-be-voted-out-and-so-could-brexitNo +ve reason to Rejoin, just a bit less shit than what we've now got? Sounds a bit like Starmer-LAB I've never heard the word "omertà" used before but perhaps LAB and even LDEM HQ have noticed opinion polling and that very few people are interested in Brexit anymore - notably CON'19 voters who both LAB and LDEM hope to win over in order to win the specific seat targets in GE'24. I would agree that the 'process' was a bitter experience and hence one I'd rather not repeat but if even Count Binface has moved on then I have sympathy (not empathy) with Rejoiners who are left with likes of just Gina Miller, Piers Corbyn and the confusingly named Rejoin.EU to vote for in GE'24 (or SNP in Scotland but they'd need to Leave.UK before Rejoin.EU)
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 20, 2023 10:59:05 GMT
grahamI can't recall any junior partner in a U.K. coalition bringing their government down. Can you? I'm also a tad surprised why you think I need to defend the liberal democrats in coalition, I didn't vote for them, I didn't want the coalition with the Tories ,if the election maths had worked out for a stable coalition between my party then Labour and the lib dems I would have been fine with that after all I was a member of the Labour party and wanted to see them stay in government.Even If something could have been cobbled together that would have lasted a year or two would have been better than letting Lord snooty in. If the lib dems had then brought such a coalition government down you would naturally have called them traitors or something like that and I too would have been mightily pissed off. Like it or not the lib dems signed up to the coalition with the Tories, I take it we can agree that we would have much preferred they hadn't. Now back to the football.
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 20, 2023 11:02:25 GMT
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Post by richardstamper on Aug 20, 2023 11:54:50 GMT
As usual little boy blue jumps in with his memory box that stopped in May 2015 Let's put aside that it wasn't my party in 2012(11 years ago) but as usual as you are a blatant Tory apologist you ignore the fact that 80% of that government consisted of tories and the Secretary of state for education at the time was Michael Gove and the minister for sport was Hugh Robertson, both Tories. Or indeed that the fall in sports funding commenced in 2009 when the coalition wasn't in office. If you actually bothered to read the article you referenced the cut in funding wasn't actually as black and white as all that anyway however Tory led governments historically have a poor history of school sport funding and provision no argument there. Go back and play with your crayons. The lady doth protest too much, methinks. I would vote Lib Dem if necessary to get rid of a Tory MP, fortunately not my situation in Oxford East, but what the the Lib Dems did in coalition is unforgiveable. They were enthusiastic supporters of the unnecessary policy of austerity which has delivered the current decrepit state of the entire public realm and also created the environment for the vote to leave the EU. They also managed to bugger up the opportunity to change our electoral system to one that values every vote. Had the coalition quislings publicly recanted and bowed out of front-line politics then your plea to forget what they did before May 2015 might be more persuasive, but Ed Davey was on the coalition front bench.
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Aug 20, 2023 11:55:18 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2023 11:56:03 GMT
More of the 'we screwed ourselves over but now let's just live with it' attitude. That seems to be all brexiters have left these days (except jib who still pretends it's going great). No, we will not live with it. Rejoin may be a long way off, but gradual realignment leading back to the single market and free movement is a game that is most definitely on in the years to come. I always read him as opposed to Brexit.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2023 12:05:12 GMT
Fuck. ⚽️- 0
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