|
Post by mercian on Aug 29, 2022 21:57:55 GMT
leftieliberal "Scotland used to be a by-word for financial acumen a couple of generations ago, but no longer." They're still tight though aren't they? Don't spoil my dearly-held beliefs! 🤣 [Note to the humourless, this is poking fun at both myself and the image that some seem to have of me]
|
|
alurqa
Member
Freiburg im Breisgau's flag
Posts: 781
|
Post by alurqa on Aug 29, 2022 22:04:04 GMT
Sounds simple, but I suspect that at the first sniff of such a plan being implemented, that the English water companies would simply incur more debt, pay enhanced dividends to shareholders, declare the company bankrupt, sack their staff and walk away. Can you do that? I thought dividends had to be paid out of profits, not debt.
|
|
domjg
Member
Posts: 5,106
|
Post by domjg on Aug 29, 2022 22:07:20 GMT
In these dismal times, a little English eccentricity can always be relied upon to provide harmless distraction and levity to lift the spirits. The annual River Football match has just taken place in, where else, Bourton on the Water. A hundred year old event and tradition, it is competed by the 1st and 2nd XIs from Bourton Rovers FC. It is played in the shallow waters of the river Windrush. This year's match, of 30 minutes duration, ended 3-3 and contained drama aplenty. A sending off (two bookable offences), a disallowed goal after consultation with a riverside VAR monitor, a saved penalty and a controversial last gasp equaliser. The referee was distracted apparently. There was also a late goalmouth scramble that led to the collapse of the goalposts! And 2,000 people turned up to watch it too. I take great comfort in knowing that these ridiculous but glorious events take place. I wish I'd been there. Aquatic football madness in the Cotswolds is where I may want to be when my time is up and I'm given thirty more minutes before I breathe my last. www.theguardian.com/football/2022/aug/29/footballers-make-a-splash-in-annual-cotswolds-river-match-bourton-on-waterHa! Wish I'd known. I was in Bourton on Saturday to visit 'Birdland' with my daughter and she paddled in that very river. I had the impression (as I have before when visiting) that half of Birmingham had decamped for the day. Lovely place, if massively touristy.
|
|
alurqa
Member
Freiburg im Breisgau's flag
Posts: 781
|
Post by alurqa on Aug 29, 2022 22:15:02 GMT
In these dismal times, a little English eccentricity can always be relied upon to provide harmless distraction and levity to lift the spirits. The annual River Football match has just taken place in, where else, Bourton on the Water. A hundred year old event and tradition, it is competed by the 1st and 2nd XIs from Bourton Rovers FC. It is played in the shallow waters of the river Windrush. YouTube has a video: www.youtube.com/watch?v=foiZ5MJpvAI
|
|
|
Post by isa on Aug 29, 2022 22:15:14 GMT
In these dismal times, a little English eccentricity can always be relied upon to provide harmless distraction and levity to lift the spirits. The annual River Football match has just taken place in, where else, Bourton on the Water. A hundred year old event and tradition, it is competed by the 1st and 2nd XIs from Bourton Rovers FC. It is played in the shallow waters of the river Windrush. This year's match, of 30 minutes duration, ended 3-3 and contained drama aplenty. A sending off (two bookable offences), a disallowed goal after consultation with a riverside VAR monitor, a saved penalty and a controversial last gasp equaliser. The referee was distracted apparently. There was also a late goalmouth scramble that led to the collapse of the goalposts! And 2,000 people turned up to watch it too. I take great comfort in knowing that these ridiculous but glorious events take place. I wish I'd been there. Aquatic football madness in the Cotswolds is where I may want to be when my time is up and I'm given thirty more minutes before I breathe my last. www.theguardian.com/football/2022/aug/29/footballers-make-a-splash-in-annual-cotswolds-river-match-bourton-on-waterI'd not heard of it before, but the BBC local news had a reporter there for the 'match'. Jolly good fun it looked, too, in that achingly pretty Cotswold town. Apparently, the drought has made the Windrush shallower than normal, so it wasn't quite as aquatic as usual. The ref, dressed as a woman, but clearly male, was actually dunked by various players whilst being interviewed for TV. British eccentricity at its best (albeit that statement might of itself be a hostage to fortune).
|
|
|
Post by leftieliberal on Aug 29, 2022 22:32:41 GMT
leftieliberal "Scotland used to be a by-word for financial acumen a couple of generations ago, but no longer." They're still tight though aren't they? Don't spoil my dearly-held beliefs! 🤣 [Note to the humourless, this is poking fun at both myself and the image that some seem to have of me] It's very noticeable that the Nats on here are very quick to move the discussion away from financial probity. Obviously a sore point with them (they don't seem to be doing very well with their ferries either) www.theweek.co.uk/business/956731/scotland-ongoing-ferry-fiasco-explained.
|
|
steve
Member
Posts: 12,295
|
Post by steve on Aug 29, 2022 22:38:38 GMT
|
|
oldnat
Member
Extremist - Undermining the UK state and its institutions
Posts: 6,101
|
Post by oldnat on Aug 29, 2022 22:55:50 GMT
Sounds simple, but I suspect that at the first sniff of such a plan being implemented, that the English water companies would simply incur more debt, pay enhanced dividends to shareholders, declare the company bankrupt, sack their staff and walk away. Can you do that? I thought dividends had to be paid out of profits, not debt. That's what the English water companies have done already. I put up the link to the analysis of their practices previously - and too late to go searching for it again!
|
|
|
Post by mercian on Aug 29, 2022 22:58:59 GMT
Catching up... jib "Certainly the costs of dealing with Victorian and Edwardian era houses where the roof water ends up in the sewer is immense, but technically quite simple - why mix clean water with human effluent in the first place!? I read in the paper yesterday that water customers in the South can look forward to drinking treated effluent in the not too distant future, although I understand the flow of the Thames is heavily constituted of effluent (treated) during the summer months in any case." Can we afford to build two parallel systems - one for rainwater and one for sewage? Also, I thought that water in London is supposed to pass through 7 people before it reaches the sea, or is that just an urban myth? ------------------------- @c-a-r-f-r-e-w "p.s. Of course, it’s possible Labour could adopt a useful compromise, of not nationalising the whole thing, but just having a state player in the market. Which might not attract such hostility from vested interests, yet still might be rather useful, pulling prices down and providing better services to compete with. (Not sure how this would work with something like water though). I’m not aware if there is any polling on this partial solution. " Yes, that is making more sense to me the more I think about it. Perhaps with water, customers could opt for the state supplier but still get their actual water from the local supplier. The supplier would have to charge what the state supplier did. Effectively a cap I suppose. ------------------------ bardin1 "...earlier in the war the Beeb would have been all over it. It appears to me that they are gauging that the public may not be as interested, which I think is wrong and helps play to the narrative that support might slacken" Or, the BBC was only interested when the Russians were winning, because they have been infiltrated by Russian stooges. ----------------------- pjw1961 "On my oft made point about YouGov's wild swings, these are the Labour leads over the Conservatives in their polls since the start of May: 1,5,8,8,4,7,6,5,3,11,11,7,1,4,9,15,8" Interesting. The first 9 of those showed no variation from one to the next of more than 4, but the last 9 include variations of 8, 6, 5,6 and 7. It looks as though something might have changed about halfway through your sequence - maybe around the end of June. Can anyone remember a Yougov methodology change around then? ------------------------------ alec "My recipe for government action, to be taken immediately:" Sounds expensive, but have you ever considered running for Parliament as you have such good solutions to everything? ---------------------- robbiealive "PS. I see Truss has bottled it again. Ducked interview agreed with N Robinson that Sunak carried through. She's beginning to resemble Johnson in her fear of democratic scrutiny." I see your point, but why should she bother? She doesn't have to convince the TV audience, but Tory party membership, and apparently she's home and dry so why take any risks? -------------------------------- domjg and crossbat11 I like the fact that Bourton has (or had) both a New Inn and an Old New Inn.
|
|
steve
Member
Posts: 12,295
|
Post by steve on Aug 29, 2022 23:11:53 GMT
oldnat Just three of the 9 "English" water companies are majority UK owned. None are " English" owned.
|
|
|
Post by pete on Aug 29, 2022 23:18:58 GMT
|
|
|
Post by pete on Aug 29, 2022 23:23:36 GMT
|
|
oldnat
Member
Extremist - Undermining the UK state and its institutions
Posts: 6,101
|
Post by oldnat on Aug 29, 2022 23:36:43 GMT
leftieliberal "Scotland used to be a by-word for financial acumen a couple of generations ago, but no longer." They're still tight though aren't they? Don't spoil my dearly-held beliefs! 🤣 [Note to the humourless, this is poking fun at both myself and the image that some seem to have of me] It's very noticeable that the Nats on here are very quick to move the discussion away from financial probity. Obviously a sore point with them (they don't seem to be doing very well with their ferries either) www.theweek.co.uk/business/956731/scotland-ongoing-ferry-fiasco-explained. It is very noticeable that you regularly express your belief that "Scots" (whether supporters of independence or not) are uniquely incapable of running their own affairs (whichever party they elected so to do).
Have the various Scottish Executives/Governments got some things wrong? Of course, just like the governments everywhere. Have they got some things right? Of course, just like governments everywhere. The UK's expensive failure to develop a new tank for the Army would be but one example of a failure. The construction of the Queensferry Crossing under budget and in advance of schedule an example of success.
I don't blame the undoubted corruption of the UK Government's involvement in the PPE for NHS England scandal as somehow being due to their being "English". If you want examples of lack of financial probity you can easily find them there. I don't blame the corruption of the Poulson affair on "Labour" just because their councillors were involved, or assume that all "Conservatives" are corrupt because of Pincher et al.
Mote and beam come to mind, in your case.
|
|
oldnat
Member
Extremist - Undermining the UK state and its institutions
Posts: 6,101
|
Post by oldnat on Aug 29, 2022 23:45:54 GMT
oldnat Just three of the 9 "English" water companies are majority UK owned. None are " English" owned. Indeed. But they are private monopolies within England, serving (or not serving!) the residents of England. The description is geographical, and it is hard to see what other description would make sense. Simply saying "water companies" would involve the ludicrous assumption that any discussion of such organisations must only be about that polity in the UK lying south of Scotland and East of Wales. Saying "British" or "UK" water companies would be just as meaningless as saying "European" companies - geographically true, but totally misleading.
Much of the property in London is owned by other states or their financial institutions. How are we to describe properties in London - Saudi? Norwegian?
"English" is not a pejorative term.
|
|
steve
Member
Posts: 12,295
|
Post by steve on Aug 30, 2022 6:02:23 GMT
oldnat Privatized water suppliers might be a better description, it's not their geographic location that is the reason for their ineptitude ( some of course are " Welsh" water companies , it's the political decision by conservative party and the subsequent brexitanian cultist anathema to proper oversight that's the issue.Scotland is fortunate to escape this particular " Brexit bonus"
|
|
steve
Member
Posts: 12,295
|
Post by steve on Aug 30, 2022 6:31:05 GMT
News that 70% of pubs face closure with tens of thousands of job losses and ruined businesses as along with other independent small business owners the vast uncapped rises in energy prices, some in excess of 400% mean that they simply can't afford to turn on the electricity or gas. It's a bizarre situation where the voracious capacity of energy providers to demand more and more for their product means they end up receiving nothing at all. Needless to say our unelected prime minister in waiting and the rest of the team of self serving lying shysters in the regime are doing absolutely nothing to address the imminent collapse.
You can hide from responsibility and you can lie about your ineptitude but it takes a special class of waste of skin to do both at the same time.
|
|
|
Post by crossbat11 on Aug 30, 2022 6:57:00 GMT
domjg/Mercian/aliuqa/isa etc
Bourton on the Water, rather like a lot of Cotswolds villages and towns (Broadway, Burford, Chipping Campden etc) are almost impossibly picturesque and, accordingly, are favourite places to visit. Birmingham and Coventry, via the motorway network (M6, M42 and M5) are barely 40 minutes away.
The beautiful Cotswold stone built houses, cobbled streets, churches and walled gardens seem to enhance the adjacent rolling and (usually) verdant countryside. Old country lanes take you hither and thither via a myriad of villages too.
Bourton's model village, the river winding through its high street and the motor museum stand it out as a tourist destination. The motor museum housed a little miniature car called "Brum" that became the subject of a 1990s BBC children's TV show bearing its name and narrated by Toya Wilcox, a resident of nearby Pershore. Both my kids loved the programme and we visited the museum many times to see Brum on display.
I have personal cricketing interest in the place too. Bourton CC, a typically beautiful ground, was where I secured the milestone of a 1,000 runs in a season. Only ever achieved it once. It was always our last game of the season in late September and we usually had a pretty liquid lunch in the Unicorn in Stow on the Wold beforehand. An end of season tradition. I needed 4 runs and secured them with a thin edge through the slips off their Gloucestershire 2nd XI opening fast bowler. I didn't last much longer! A Gower-esque dab to gulley did for me.
The cricket ground was adjacent to Bourton Rovers FC pitch and they were normally playing when we were there. There was always a sending off too in the game as I recall! When fielding I used to keep my eye on the match, as we all did really. The sparse crowd watching the football glanced regularly at the cricket too.
A pleasant and soothing early autumn juxtaposition of our two national sports, and a simultaneous indulging in probably two of my biggest passions in life as well.
|
|
Danny
Member
Posts: 9,837
|
Post by Danny on Aug 30, 2022 6:58:24 GMT
colin One of the major advantages of having privatised water companies is that massive infrastructure improvements like the Thames Tideway are financed by the private sector, and do not add to the UK public debt. So whats wrong with public debt? We just spent like water to pay for lcokdown which didnt do any good. Why is it a bad thing to use national debt when everything i read says the final cost is less than using private debt? Wasnt that due to EU bathing water standards imposed on the UK? All the privatised industries have done when all these same issues were raised and promises made to fix them once privatisation happened 30 years ago...is bugger all except syphon off money to shareholders. Which to be fair to them, is why they bought the water companies- so they could extort from their customers. It is hardly a surprise.
|
|
Danny
Member
Posts: 9,837
|
Post by Danny on Aug 30, 2022 7:16:46 GMT
" European natural gas prices plunged the most since April after Germany said its gas stores are filling up faster than planned ahead of winter. Benchmark Dutch front-month futures fell as much as 16% to 286 euros per megawatt-hour, reversing last week’s jump of almost 40%. In Germany, gas storage facilities are filling up fast, according to Economy Minister Robert Habeck. The region’s biggest economy is set to meet an October target of 85% full already next month, he said in a statement on Sunday. news this morning was talking about meeting of Eu energy ministers. It mentioned the german stocks, but it also said EU gas usage has fallen 15% because of measures already intoduced. Coincidentally Russia produced about 15% of world gas.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 30, 2022 7:18:19 GMT
"Europe faces years of energy rationing without Russian gas, the boss of Shell has warned. Ben van Beurden said it was a “fantasy” to think that Europe’s energy crisis would be resolved soon and he warned that if Moscow were to cut off all supplies, life would be “very hard”.
“I do not think this crisis is going to be limited to just one winter,” the chief executive of Europe’s biggest oil and gas group said yesterday.
Van Beurden said it “may well be that we have a number of winters where we have to somehow find solutions through efficiency savings, through rationing and through a very quick build-out of alternatives,” such as gas imports from elsewhere and developing non-gas energy sources.
“That this is going to somehow be easy, or over, is a fantasy we should put aside,” he told a press conference in Norway, according to Montel, an energy news site."
Times
"Britain will plunge into recession before the end of this year and the economy will keep contracting throughout 2023, Goldman Sachs has warned. CBI services sector businesses said that with costs soaring they expected employment levels to start to fall, that declining profits would continue to weaken and that investment would be reduced.
PwC, the Big Four professional services and accounting group, reported that high street stores were continuing to close their doors at a rate of a dozen a day.
Meanwhile, figures from Mazars, the accountant, showed that the number of manufacturing businesses going bust in the year to the end of June had risen to 1,454, up by 63 per cent on a year earlier."
Times.
|
|
Danny
Member
Posts: 9,837
|
Post by Danny on Aug 30, 2022 7:30:22 GMT
But it is YouGov again. Excessive movement one way producing an apparently large move back in the next poll. They do this over and over again. Back in the day when we got more regular and detailed reporting, I noticed yougov was reporting two different regular polls. And these systematically gave different results. So the effect of posting one then the other was always to play ping pong with their predictions. I assumed this was because they have fixed panels for the two polls, and their makeup was somehow biased differently. If you lived where I do you wouldn't think that water quality was being over played. I was talking to Lifeguards the other day at Bexhill. A long stretch of the East Sussex coast has been despoiled in recent weeks-turds floating in the sea. Hastings and Bexhill are adjacent towns and run into each other, but water is provided by different companies from different resources. Hastings used to have reports of sewage on the beach, but some decades ago the sea outfall was considerably lengthened supposedly ending the problem. Bexhill outfalls dump directly onto the beach and spray merrily at low tide. I dont know whether sewage is managed separately between the towns, but the bills are from different companies and Hastings has more reliable water supply and better removal of the waste. Southern water was fined last year too for its failings. It's probably policy not to spend anything to fix the problem but instead pay any fines. Sounds simple, but I suspect that at the first sniff of such a plan being implemented, that the English water companies would simply incur more debt, pay enhanced dividends to shareholders, declare the company bankrupt, sack their staff and walk away. Which would leave their assets and staff ripe to be taken under national control, while their bankers swallow the debt?
|
|
steve
Member
Posts: 12,295
|
Post by steve on Aug 30, 2022 8:47:40 GMT
Some might have come across the corporate aphorism that "As hire As; Bs hire Cs".
It doesn't say what Ds do... guess we'll find out next week.
|
|
steve
Member
Posts: 12,295
|
Post by steve on Aug 30, 2022 8:51:20 GMT
Liz Truss next tv interview
|
|
neilj
Member
Posts: 6,038
|
Post by neilj on Aug 30, 2022 9:02:02 GMT
Useful graph of how polls have moved since the 2019 election
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 30, 2022 9:20:36 GMT
|
|
Danny
Member
Posts: 9,837
|
Post by Danny on Aug 30, 2022 9:33:55 GMT
yeah but isnt that just washing along from bexhill? I'd imagine SE water will be upset to be receiving S water's sewage on their beach?
|
|
steve
Member
Posts: 12,295
|
Post by steve on Aug 30, 2022 9:47:54 GMT
Attachment DeletedTruss is terrified of Tory friendly Nick Robinson at the Tory run BBC, she's going to love PMQ's.
|
|
|
Post by alec on Aug 30, 2022 9:55:31 GMT
@danny - "Hastings used to have reports of sewage on the beach..."
Was that in 2019, and did anyone notice?
|
|
|
Post by leftieliberal on Aug 30, 2022 10:00:24 GMT
Mote and beam come to mind, in your case.Hypocritical comes to mind in your case. I shouldn't have to remind everyone that you started this particular conversation, with one of your usual snide digs.
|
|
neilj
Member
Posts: 6,038
|
Post by neilj on Aug 30, 2022 10:29:34 GMT
The Brexiteers favourite economist
|
|