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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2024 21:48:07 GMT
I see pjw1961 has had an active evening on UKPR2. I hope he has not missed the news that Braintree Town have this evening been promoted to the Bananarama National League along with champions Yeovil Town. Onward and upward! |
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steve
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Post by steve on May 6, 2024 21:49:13 GMT
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Danny
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Post by Danny on May 6, 2024 22:04:47 GMT
To put this in context, there was a (now famous) Chinese publication from March 2020 which stated very clearly that the epidemiology of the early SARs 2 outbreak in Wuhan was such that only airborne transmission could explain it, and this was ignored by virtually 100% of western health authorities. So you are saying that when government said people should stay two metres apart, that just didnt work, so they all caught covid from each other anyway? ie the lockdown measures didnt work, which is rather what I have said all along? waste of a trillion pounds? So what did you think happened when shortly before lockdown evryone had had notice it was going to happen and so we all charged off to the supermarkets to stock up on food? They were rammed solid with people, you couldnt avoid bumping into each other? and then a few weeks later we had the peak of cases. You dont suppose that how that was handled caused the April peak, not how people would have behaved if we had just gone on as normal, but BECAUSE of the interventions? and then of course it faded away, because it would never have spiked like that if government had not organised the biggest mass spreading event in the history of the epidemic? |
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Post by mercian on May 6, 2024 22:12:24 GMT
steve "Refuk unlike UKIP aren't a real political party, they have no members " I raised this with one of their representatives and was told that they became a members' party last Autumn, though I've seen no evidence of a recruitment drive. They now allow members, but the members have no control, Farage remaining the majority shareholder of the limited company. You could argue that the Conservative, Labour and even Liberal Democrat and SNP members have made such a shambles of electing leaders in recent years that perhaps Farage is showing untypical wisdom  It's that that makes me wonder about Farage's true intentions. Also, isn't it very dangerous to have a limited company acting as a political party? I know Reform aren't going to be elected and probably won't win a single seat, but it sets a precedent. I don't suppose Labour would do it, but suppose at some point in the future the Tory party decided to become a limited company, won a GE, and then got a generous takeover did from an American consortium? Or Russian or Chinese or anything else. Even another British company? I am surprised it was allowed. Also, if Reform is a limited company, what's to prevent some nation-wide company with good brand recognition and a good reputation such as one of the big supermarkets putting up candidates? |
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pjw1961
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Post by pjw1961 on May 6, 2024 22:18:28 GMT
I see pjw1961 has had an active evening on UKPR2. I hope he has not missed the news that Braintree Town have this evening been promoted to the Bananarama National League along with champions Yeovil Town. Onward and upward! We've been there before and it didn't last long I'm afraid. |
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Post by leftieliberal on May 6, 2024 22:25:01 GMT
Also, isn't it very dangerous to have a limited company acting as a political party? It's not a public limited company, so it's more the case that Farage would have to sell his shares to someone else. Anyway, I think you will find that the Electoral Commission who have to register all political parties before they can operate in the UK, have a rather better "fit and proper persons" test than the Premier League do. |
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pjw1961
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Post by pjw1961 on May 6, 2024 22:26:14 GMT
Also, if Reform is a limited company, what's to prevent some nation-wide company with good brand recognition and a good reputation such as o ne of the big supermarkets putting up candidates? Well of course in a way the Co-op do, although the Co-operative Party is a proper political party and doesn't run the retail side. All part of the Co-operative movement though. Technically the 4th largest party in the HoC, although they are all also Labour MPs. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Co-operative_PartyAnd there are also plenty of the Sainsbury family involved in politics, both Tory and LoC, down the years. |
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Post by mercian on May 6, 2024 22:31:29 GMT
Also, isn't it very dangerous to have a limited company acting as a political party? It's not a public limited company, so it's more the case that Farage would have to sell his shares to someone else. Anyway, I think you will find that the Electoral Commission who have to register all political parties before they can operate in the UK, have a rather better "fit and proper persons" test than the Premier League do. Yes but suppose The Conservative Party Limited (a private company) in a few years' time persuaded it's shareholders to accept a generous offer from Trump plc (or whatever the US calls these things) for instance? |
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Post by mercian on May 6, 2024 22:37:49 GMT
Also, if Reform is a limited company, what's to prevent some nation-wide company with good brand recognition and a good reputation such as o ne of the big supermarkets putting up candidates? Well of course in a way the Co-op do, although the Co-operative Party is a proper political party and doesn't run the retail side. All part of the Co-operative movement though. Technically the 4th largest party in the HoC, although they are all also Labour MPs. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Co-operative_PartyAnd there are also plenty of the Sainsbury family involved in politics, both Tory and LoC, down the years. Good point. I'd forgotten about them. Easy to do when they are also Labour MPs as you say. And of course individuals like the Sainsburys are perfectly entitled to get involved. However the Co-op are not a limited company (unless things have changed recently). The Co-op is much more like a traditional party - 'owned' by its members. I wonder how (say) the Tesco party would do for instance, or the Virgin party? A lot better than some of the fringe parties for certain. Can anyone predict that we would never have a BP government? These are just imaginary random examples of course. It's the principle that concerns me. |
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oldnat
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Post by oldnat on May 6, 2024 23:25:25 GMT
Well of course in a way the Co-op do, although the Co-operative Party is a proper political party and doesn't run the retail side. All part of the Co-operative movement though. Technically the 4th largest party in the HoC, although they are all also Labour MPs. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Co-operative_PartyAnd there are also plenty of the Sainsbury family involved in politics, both Tory and LoC, down the years. Good point. I'd forgotten about them. Easy to do when they are also Labour MPs as you say. And of course individuals like the Sainsburys are perfectly entitled to get involved. However the Co-op are not a limited company (unless things have changed recently). The Co-op is much more like a traditional party - 'owned' by its members. I wonder how (say) the Tesco party would do for instance, or the Virgin party? A lot better than some of the fringe parties for certain. Can anyone predict that we would never have a BP government? These are just imaginary random examples of course. It's the principle that concerns me. |
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Post by alec on May 7, 2024 6:42:42 GMT
Danny - "You dont suppose that how that was handled caused the April peak, not how people would have behaved if we had just gone on as normal, but BECAUSE of the interventions?" No. Nor does anyone else, bar a few nutters on the fringes of the internet. Lockdown measures, both mandatory and voluntary, were *brilliantly* successful at substantially reducing cases, and are still proving massively effective for the 15% or so of people who still need or want to protect themselves from infection. You should try assessing the evidence instead of living deep up your own bottom for a change.
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Post by bardin1 on May 7, 2024 7:22:50 GMT
Charles III is a vastly wealthy, fantiasticly privileged, opinionated, short-tempered old man with an extremely narrow experience of life. Not so very different from a number of UKPR2 contributors in many ways... but because of who he is, his foibles, biases and failures of understanding are far from innocuous. Damn, I missed out on the vastly wealthy bit! Mark! Membership fraud detected! |
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steve
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Post by steve on May 7, 2024 7:27:21 GMT
Maga maniacs already setting the groundwork for another insurrection repeated statements that the only " legitimate " election result they will accept is if the criminal wins. I really don't think it's evident either in the UK or the U.S. general population how far beyond the normal political partisanship knockabout claims this is. It would be akin in the UK not to Sunakered making absurd claims about the state of the parties chances of winning at the general election ( zero) but saying that the only legitimate result would be a Tory win and if the vote said otherwise it would be fake, to be ignored, that Keir Starmer and Ed Davey should be prosecuted along with judges and all independent news outlets should lose their broadcasting licence, these rules being enforced by the police and military, any police service refusing to comply should be defunded and any senior military officer who objected should be shot.All senior civil servants will be sacked and replaced by regime appointees loyal to Sunak. It sounds ludicrous, because it is, but it's precisely where the republican party now finds itself. There's only one party that believes in democracy and the rule of law left for the U.S. and however flawed the current president might be he's the only current plausible candidate who doesn't aspire to end democracy. youtu.be/SnE6TxzI88Q?si=r9EJTVEKufkm-_0- |
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Post by bardin1 on May 7, 2024 7:29:47 GMT
I've been thinking now most of the population live in urban areas we don't get to see much of nature these days so I thought let's see what people know about the natural kingdom with a little game of guess the animal. I'm not certain but I think this one is a Shetland pony. View AttachmentChris Brookmyre? |
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steve
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Post by steve on May 7, 2024 7:33:32 GMT
bardin1 For the avoidance of doubt I am not and never have been Charles Windsor. Are you listening at the back? Attachment Deleted
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steve
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Post by steve on May 7, 2024 7:36:46 GMT
How the world sees the covid pandemic this from worldometer.
"As of April 13, 2024, the Coronavirus Tracker is no longer being updated due to the unfeasibility of providing statistically valid global totals, as the majority of countries have now stopped reporting."
And just in case people might have forgotten those who caught covid were ten thousand times more likely to die if they were over 85 than if they were under 20.
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Danny
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Post by Danny on May 7, 2024 7:56:32 GMT
Research finding of a gene APOE4, which if you have two copies of the same then you have a 95% chance of getting altzheimers after 65. This doesn't seem to be completely new news, googling I found a page one year old explaining two copies of APOE4 increases your risk x10. APOE is an important gene affecting cholesterol management and yet another paper talks about the human APOE4 variant emerging 1.8 million years ago, at the time humans (or their ancestors) moved from a sedentary life to a more active one, and the gene change improved ability to release energy for endurance in constant activity (so for example sustained running). Whereas the APOE2 and 3 versions emerged only 200,000 years ago and give better longevity in sedentary populations. Interestingly the deleterious effects of e4 do not appear until after child bearing age, so genetic selection to introduced the 2 and 3 variants relied upon parents and grandparents surviving longer and fitter after having children giving an advantage in offspring survival. www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6471373/e3 is the most common variant of the gene worldwide, but the variants are unevenly distributed geographically. The lowest european occurrence of e4 is in the south (5-10%), increasing to 16% in France, germany and 23% in Scandinavia. 30% in Finland. This distribution might reflect climate affecting the overall outcome from each gene. A sudy of people living in Ghana subject to high disease mortality found women with one copy of the e4 version on average had one extra child. Whereas those with two copies had 3.5 extra children. A clear evolutionary advantage in a high physical and disease stress environment. e4 may still give survival advantages to those in western sedentary societies at younger rather than older ages. The e2 version which is protective against altzheimer risk, carries a higher rate of recorded infections while young. e4 increases the effectiveness of the immune system and those with e4 have higher levels of vitamin D, which is lower in low sunshine areas, and would be a reason why it is more beneficial in N rather than s europe. So...although e4 might increase your risk of dying from altzheimers, it might also increase your chance of living long enough to do so. |
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Danny
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Post by Danny on May 7, 2024 8:20:37 GMT
Danny - "You dont suppose that how that was handled caused the April peak, not how people would have behaved if we had just gone on as normal, but BECAUSE of the interventions?" No. Nor does anyone else, bar a few nutters on the fringes of the internet. Lockdown measures, both mandatory and voluntary, were *brilliantly* successful at substantially reducing cases, and are still proving massively effective for the 15% or so of people who still need or want to protect themselves from infection. You should try assessing the evidence instead of living deep up your own bottom for a change. Its a no brainer based upon everything you say you believe that the overcrowding in supermarkets before lockdown massively spread the disease. People crowded together, no masks, no physical barriers, no ventilation, young shoulder to shoulder with old. The only way it could not have caused a surge in the epidemic is if there were no community cases yet to be spread. This getout was rather the thinking of those in charge, who had to collapse their staged response to covid arriving in the UK because as soon as they started community testing for it they discovered it was everywhere, they didnt believe it was here yet but it was and they had missed it. The official measure of whether it exists or not has always been if a specific covid test was performed rather than if someone is ill with a disease having covid symptoms. You still deny I had covid in 2019 despite having a disease with the key symptom of loss of taste and smell which zoe determined in 2020 as 95% certain of identifying covid, a perfect example of how the authorities behaved. Authorities had no idea how fast covid was spreading in the community because they werent looking or testing, and because the effects of covid are different on young and old. The old are the ones who get seriously ill and report for medical help, the young do not get seriously ill but are the group spreadingnit through society. So those authorities had no way to tell how much covid was in the Uk jan, feb, mar...2020 because they werent testing and did not accept any other evidence. They assumed there was no community disease to be spread in crowded supermarkets, but there was. We know there was because the april peak happened, and it could not have come from nothing. The irony beyond that attempting to halt covid created this mass spreading event, if that it brought together the young who have always had most covid cases and are responsiblen for propagating the disease within society, and the old who are normally protected by virtue of being retired and not socialising much...but who of course still have to get out to shop. In fact it can be the highlight of the week, getting out to shop. Government created a mass spread event which caused a wave of recordable cases coinciding with the April peak. Calling lockdown was a self fulfilling prophecy in creating a big spike of cases. Of course the cases fell off rapidly thereafter, because the mass spread event government had organised then stopped. This interpretation explains why lockdown never performed in future months as well as it had seemed to work that April. Because acttually it wasnt the lockdown suppressing covid so much as the reversal of the disruption of society prior to lockdown which caused a surge of cases. |
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Danny
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Post by Danny on May 7, 2024 8:22:38 GMT
Maga maniacs already setting the groundwork for another insurrection repeated statements that the only " legitimate " election result they will accept is if the criminal wins. Isnt that what the brexiteers said? The only result they would accept was if we left the EU? A plan for the next referendum was already begun before the first results were called. |
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steve
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Post by steve on May 7, 2024 8:49:25 GMT
"Isnt that what the brexiteers said? The only result they would accept was if we left the EU? A plan for the next referendum was already begun before the first results were called."
Not really , there's a significant difference between losing and wanting to win a future vote ( that's what elections are about after all) and lying about the result in the first place.
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Post by graham on May 7, 2024 9:01:33 GMT
I am no longer able to comment on PoliticalBetting.com. Access to this function has been withdrawn as a result of my having referred to 'Netanyahu's Einzatzgruppen.'A couple of guys 'flagged' it up to bring its attention to the Moderators. I feel this is far too censotius and that my comment was a fair and reasonable expression of opinion . In no sense was it AntiSemitic. Any views?
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neilj
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Post by neilj on May 7, 2024 9:01:47 GMT
More in Common
Our latest
@moreincommon_
voting intention, has very small changes: the Conservatives reverse their dip from last week and Labour lead by 17.
🌹 Labour 43% (-)
🌳Conservatives 26% (+2)
🔶Lib Dem 10% (-1)
🟣Reform UK 11% (-)
💚Greens 5% (-)
N:2135
2-3/5
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steve
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Post by steve on May 7, 2024 9:07:34 GMT
In obsessed with the government of over a decade ago news ( no not that one)
Tory lie central has put this out as a rebuttal to Rachel Reeves address later today.
"The personnel may change but the Labour party hasn’t. Rachel Reeves still hero-worships Gordon Brown, who sold off our gold reserves and whose hubris took Britain to the brink of financial collapse.
Labour have no plan and would take us back to square one with higher taxes, higher unemployment, an illegal amnesty on immigration and a plot to betray pensioners, just like Gordon Brown did"
Apart from the fact that Reeves has been quite complimentary about Gordon Brown's time as chancellor and Prime minister, she's not actually said anything about him other than in a speech in July last year but she did at least say something then.
There isn't even a passing nodding acquaintance with reality in anything else the Tories splurged out,none of which address the disclosed contents of the speech,which is the predictable stuff.
Tory lie central in response to the nonsense about a potential hung parliament have also taken out their old " coalition of chaos" for a spin.
The implication being that a Starmer led minority might have to rely on the pro European union pro treating asylum seekers like human beings lib dems.
Now obviously I would say what's not to like. But frankly even those not affiliated with my party would look at the two Knights leading the Labour and lib dems and their first thought isn't going to be " coalition of chaos " is it!
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steve
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Post by steve on May 7, 2024 9:16:57 GMT
graham I had to look up" Einzatzgruppen" but given it refers to SS paramilitary death squads what the actual fuck did you think would happen on a more tightly moderated and far bigger site than this one! If Rather than immediately pulling out your well thumbed copy of Goodwin's law you had referred to what was happening directly you might still have been able to post there. Mind you I was banned in UKPR original for not being sufficiently non partisan so think yourself lucky.
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Post by graham on May 7, 2024 9:24:04 GMT
graham I had to look up" Einzatzgruppen" but given it refers to SS paramilitary death squads what the actual fuck did you think would happen on a more tightly moderated and far bigger site than this one! If Rather than immediately pulling out your well thumbed copy of Goodwin's law you had referred to what was happening directly you might still have been able to post there. Mind you I was banned in UKPR original for not being sufficiently non partisan so think yourself lucky. I am far from being alone in using 'Einzatzgruppen' to describe the behaviour of some elements of Netenyahu's IDF in Gaza. My comments were also rather provoked by another blogger who suggested that 'Bibi is too weak.'
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steve
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Post by steve on May 7, 2024 9:25:57 GMT
grahamThey're probably banned from posting as well! Meanwhile In a speech this morning, Labour’s shadow chancellor Rachel Reeves accused the government of peddling “economic fiction” Which is of course entirely accurate. Can we therefore assume that any reference to " making Brexit work" will no longer feature in Labour utterances.
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steve
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Post by steve on May 7, 2024 9:42:31 GMT
100% agree.
"I will build at least 10,000 council homes. As for right to buy – suspend it for new properties
There’s no point us building houses if people sell them off cheaply to no public benefit. It’s like running a bath with no plug"
Andy Burnham
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Post by leftieliberal on May 7, 2024 10:03:41 GMT
graham I had to look up" Einzatzgruppen" but given it refers to SS paramilitary death squads what the actual fuck did you think would happen on a more tightly moderated and far bigger site than this one! If Rather than immediately pulling out your well thumbed copy of Goodwin's law you had referred to what was happening directly you might still have been able to post there. Mind you I was banned in UKPR original for not being sufficiently non partisan so think yourself lucky. One might quite validly describe the illegal settlement building in the West Bank as "lebensraum" but I wouldn't have been surprised if that had got you banned as well. |
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Post by shevii on May 7, 2024 10:08:18 GMT
100% agree. "I will build at least 10,000 council homes. As for right to buy – suspend it for new properties There’s no point us building houses if people sell them off cheaply to no public benefit. It’s like running a bath with no plug" Andy Burnham Agree with that- but there is also no point building houses if net immigration is 300k plus a year (I'm not going to quote the 700k because I suspect this is a temporary figure). It's like running a bath with no plug :-) There has to be a technocratic non EDL solution to this. I'd also favour a policy that prioritised refugees, although the departed (from these boards) Colin made the point there is likely to be no end to refugees through war and climate change and there will be a limit whether progressives at the moment think there is or not . I don't feel any party has a rounded policy towards the housing crisis really, and the progressive parties doing some basic tweaks aren't going to help much. A lot of what happened during New Labour (when the truly huge break was made between wages and housing costs) was to keep the economy booming to the detriment of everyone today who can't get on the housing ladder. |
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Post by leftieliberal on May 7, 2024 10:14:32 GMT
Trump's hush-money trial brings to mind that the Feds finally brought down Al Capone by convicting him of tax evasion. Let's hope that the precedent holds.
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