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Post by mercian on Dec 7, 2023 21:25:41 GMT
Do you think that there's anybody in the UK that believes the Tories have even a vague chance of winning the next GE whether it be May or October or anywhere in between. Just think, if this had been a coalition government, the minority party would have walked out years ago and let the country have its say. Highly unlikely but nothings impossible. Suppose we get involved in a war? National government with no GE until we've won perhaps. |
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Post by mercian on Dec 7, 2023 21:32:47 GMT
Also school is about learning community values as well as education and you never know what some nutjob parents might be teaching their kids, with no chance of any counterbalance. Yes, some of them might even teach their kids to be socialists. 😁 |
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Dec 7, 2023 21:33:30 GMT
This seems to ne the bigger danger to the Bill, if the remaining one nation tory MPs decide they can't support it
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Post by mercian on Dec 7, 2023 21:34:57 GMT
Mr Poppy"FWIW then the CON Home article (and I post there under a pseudonym so no need for the trolls to try to find me - stick to UKPR2 where you can be ignored please  )" I think your style might be recognisable.
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Post by joeboy on Dec 7, 2023 21:35:43 GMT
Exactly right Joeboy. Duckenfield fucked up and then SYP lied their arses off in order to shift blame onto the innocent and the victims. 35 years on, as we saw from Mercian’s post, the lies of those who swore to uphold the laws of the land live on. I was six years into a thirty year Met civil service career when Hillsborough happened. I was on the terraces at Upton Park the day it happened. I went into work on the Monday and heard mate after mate blame the fans. I cracked and said “I think we’ll find out it was the police’s fault”. What I said didn’t get a good reaction it’s fair to say. Many of my police mates still blame the fans. It’s a mind-set. I suppose it's a natural enough reaction to close ranks but 96 people died as the result of a stupid error. I think it was Duckenfield's first major game in charge so maybe he just didn't understand about the tunnel. Even so, once the mistake was made it shouldn't have being inevitable that 96 people died. The truth is, closed in pens combined with fencing and locked safety gates killed the fans at Hillsborough. So blaming Duckenfield alone is harsh in many ways, it was the attempted cover up that was so counter productive. Fortunately Justice Taylor concentrated on safety going forward, rather than be drawn into the blame game. What makes me shudder is that it could have happened at a number of grounds, and to any group of fans. Fortunately, Chelsea were fairly crap back then (apart from a brief flurry in the mid 80s) so we didn't get to many semi final e.t.c, but I do remember one occasion at Brighton when they just let more and more Chelsea fans into the away section. Eventually the crush became serious and chelsea fans started pulling down fences and spilling onto the pitch. Of course it was reported as hooliganism but people could have died that day, but for the 'hooligans'. Have to admit for very different reason I didn't feel that safe on the South Bank over the years😊 |
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Post by mercian on Dec 7, 2023 21:59:58 GMT
An education system that is set up to ensure that children of the wealthy are especially narcissistic, psychopathic and Machiavellian sounds like bad news to me, and something worth changing. Or perhaps many of the wealthy are already narcissistic etc and it's hereditary? |
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Post by mercian on Dec 7, 2023 22:17:04 GMT
Ah, thanks for that Batty, I really hope he saw the match the other day. Yes, it's a nice little snippet, isn't it? Of course there was much more to him than just being a Villa supporter, but he was my sort of celebrity football fan. Him and Geezer Butler of the Sabs who, like Benjamin was born down the road from Villa Park. Geezer, like Ozzy, was an Aston lad. Two real brummies. Nigel Kennedy, Prince William, Tom Hanks, David Cameron, Mervyn King etc? Less so, I think. It would be nice to think Benjamin might have been watching the Villa v City game last night, but I don't know how ill he was towards the end. He'd only been diagnosed with a brain tumour eight weeks ago. It may have been very sudden. Desperately sad. Yes very sad, but pedantry alert. Aston didn't become part of Birmingham until 1911, nearly 40 years after the Villa were formed. Therefore being born in Aston doesn't make you a 'real brummie' (IMO) unlike my grandad who was born in Watery Lane, Small Heath. Ironically, he played for Villa in their very early days. |
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Post by mercian on Dec 7, 2023 22:22:08 GMT
Is anyone else not just a tad worried that a UK Government is writing legislation that specifically prevents UK Courts holding them to account? Yes, it's rather chilling - it's effectively an attempt to completely undermine the rule of law, yet even the better parts of the media seem more fixated on internal Tory party dramas that this, which is rather concerning. I mean, the absolute state of the below tweets. Dangerous lunatics. Except of course that Parliament is the law-making body, so if the bill goes through it will be the law. The lawyers brought this on themselves by abusing the system to undermine government policy. |
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Dec 7, 2023 22:27:58 GMT
Have to admit for very different reason I didn't feel that safe on the South Bank over the years😊 |
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Post by somerjohn on Dec 7, 2023 22:30:32 GMT
Mercian: "The lawyers brought this on themselves by abusing the system to undermine government policy."
So you think that holding the government to account is abusing the system? That the courts should just be there to uphold the government?
It's a point of view. One shared by Orbán, Trump, Kaczyński, Erdoğan, Putin... and, seemingly Mercian.
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Post by mercian on Dec 7, 2023 22:31:44 GMT
"I didn't vote for him either, but as I am a UK subject " Actually you're a British citizen not a subject and Spaffer wasn't head of state. You owe no allegiance to him or to a head of state selected by accident of birth. You didn't vote for Charles Windsor either. Well you've taught me something there. Apparently it was changed in 1981. I will amend my statement to say "I didn't vote for him either, but as I am a British citizen and he was the UK PM he was my PM" I don't think I claimed that 'Spaffer' as you call him was head of state. I didn't vote for Charles of course because he's the hereditary monarch. Therefore he is my king, and yours whether you like it or not. Perhaps one day you might get a republic, but there's no guarantee that you'd be able to vote for the head of state then either. |
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Post by alec on Dec 7, 2023 22:32:50 GMT
For those interested, I've just posted brief discussion of covid and cancer risks on the dedicated thread, including a really good article from Fortune magazine discussing the topic. Around a fifth of cancers are known to be caused by viruses, and many others result from inflammatory responses (the majority of us will die from one of many inflammatory conditions) so it isn't unreasonable to hypothesize that covid may be cancer inducing. However, as discussed in the article, although there is some early data suggesting this, it's uncertain and will take time for any clear signals to be picked up.
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Post by mercian on Dec 7, 2023 22:39:58 GMT
Actually we are evolved to live in very small social groups. We're absolutely not evolved to experience large crowds, big classrooms etc. Schools represent a situation that is completely alien to us in evolutionary terms. How do you know? Were you there? A state class is typically 30 kids. Private 10-20. When I was at state Primary school, most classes were over 40 (50 one year). In my Direct Grant school in the 1960s classes were 24+. If classes nowadays are as small as you say perhaps some of them could be merged to ameliorate the shortage of teachers? |
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Post by mercian on Dec 7, 2023 22:41:34 GMT
The Queen in Alice in Wonderland: "Why, sometimes I've believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast" www.goodreads.com/quotes/9467-alice-laughed-there-s-no-use-trying-she-said-one-can-tNB Other than a Covid essay from someone 'new' being dragged into that and predictable comments from someone whose posts I can't hide then the only posts on the last few pages are from you! I get the message but I hope you appreciate the pedantry.. for old times sake Pleased to see Trevor has finally reached peak blocking. Now he need not be exposed to any contrary view to his own. Bless. I nearly replied to him asking what was the point of posting, but if it makes him happy... |
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pjw1961
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Post by pjw1961 on Dec 7, 2023 22:59:20 GMT
Pleased to see Trevor has finally reached peak blocking. Now he need not be exposed to any contrary view to his own. Bless. I nearly replied to him asking what was the point of posting, but if it makes him happy... Doesn't seem to though. |
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pjw1961
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Post by pjw1961 on Dec 7, 2023 23:01:25 GMT
This seems to ne the bigger danger to the Bill, if the remaining one nation tory MPs decide they can't support it Sorry, but I gave up on believing "moderate" Tories will do anything years ago. They have about as much backbone as the average jellyfish. |
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Post by mercian on Dec 7, 2023 23:03:49 GMT
Mercian: "The lawyers brought this on themselves by abusing the system to undermine government policy."So you think that holding the government to account is abusing the system? That the courts should just be there to uphold the government? It's a point of view. One shared by Orbán, Trump, Kaczyński, Erdoğan, Putin... and, seemingly Mercian. |
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Post by somerjohn on Dec 7, 2023 23:19:54 GMT
Mercian: www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-66320938You were responding to posts about the "UK Government ... writing legislation that specifically prevents UK Courts holding them to account" Your link to a BBC report about the doings of allegedly dodgy solicitors is irrelevant to that point, and to my post about your seeming political soulmates. |
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Post by bendo on Dec 8, 2023 0:43:01 GMT
I read that, and though it does designate some things as myths, I was thinking of what happened after the gates were opened, when hundreds of fans charged in. Your link doesn't address that. If they had walked in, the disaster wouldn't have happened. This does not absolve the police and ground authorities of blame. I'm sure I once saw some footage of the fans charging in after the gates were opened, but can't now find it. I got the chief copper's name wrong. It was of course Duckenfield. I guess there will always be idiots who make stupid comments on subjects they clearly know nothing about and can't be bothered to spend a small amount of time reading about. Fans didn’t arrive late, they arrived at the time they would be expected to. They didn't rush in? They entered, and the majority went straight to the centre as the idiot's in the control room hadn't bothered to close it off despite clearly being full. Numerous reports and inquiries have absolved the fans if blame, it clearly lay with the authorities that chose to put someone with no experience in charge and allowed the match to be playedv at aground with no valid safety certificate. Maybe engage your brain before perpetuating the same offensive nonsense again? |
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Post by jen on Dec 8, 2023 3:57:28 GMT
"Therefore he is my king, and yours whether you like it or not." That rather depends upon what part of the UK one lives in. There is not one unified UK constitution. I accept that you enjoy doffing your cap to your German conquerors, but please understand there are parts of these islands where, according to their constitution, sovereignty remains the gift of the people. |
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steve
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Post by steve on Dec 8, 2023 6:14:23 GMT
jen As far as I'm aware Charles Windsor is the unelected head of state of all of the U.K, where isn't this the case? I would much prefer an elected head of state rather than by hereditary accident of birth , but as an alternative why not make it a five year appointment given out as a lottery win, should at least expand the gene pool from the inbred Windsor clan and reduce the cost of the vast number of the extended family. When I became a police officer I swore an affirmation ( it was queen in those days) the wording has changed slightly both the meaning is the same the current affirmation is: "I (name) ...of (police force)... do solemnly and sincerely declare and affirm that I will well and truly serve the King in the office of constable, with fairness, integrity, diligence and impartiality, upholding fundamental human rights and according equal respect to all people; and that I will, to the best of my power, cause the peace to be kept and preserved and prevent all offences against people and property; and that while I continue to hold the said office I will to the best of my skill and knowledge discharge all the duties thereof faithfully according to law." As a republican then and now I regarded the bit about the queen as shorthand for service to the crown in the sense of the state, i.e. to serve the public. I of course don't know what others might have thought. I met Elizabeth Windsor when I was seconded to Buckingham palace firearms team after the Fagan royal break in, I'd just got firearms status and it made a break from guarding El Al's offices in regent street. She seemed quite a nice woman for what it's worth. It wasn't àn in depth conversation of course just an exchange of greetings But she seemed rather fond of " her" police officers. But that doesn't mean I had " allegiance " to her or her offspring. No person deserves allegiance, that's what dictatorships want.
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Dec 8, 2023 6:25:53 GMT
The problem is that UK branches of multinationals generally make little profit. This is because profits are redirected to their head offices via loan repayments, payments for use of the brand and so on But of course we could introduce regulations to close such loopholes for regulated industries like water and electricity companies. This has been an easy and obvious thing to do for maybe 10-20 years since I first heard about it? we could have prevented the vast sums taken out of these companies which are now bankrupt. (or, as the case may be, still fleecing the public) |
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Post by neilj on Dec 8, 2023 6:37:56 GMT
The Rwandan scheme has more than doubled in cost to £290m and not a single asylum seeker sent there or likely to be sent there
The Tax payer is being bled dry
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Post by steve on Dec 8, 2023 6:42:20 GMT
Public service posting of the week. If you're stuck for an appropriate epithet when faced by the hard of thinking here's a handy tool A Shakespearean insult generator.  So the next time you're confronted by a fobbing elf coated flap dragon, you'll be properly equipped. |
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Post by neilj on Dec 8, 2023 6:56:02 GMT
Despite being told by lawyers it won't work Sunak went ahead anyway
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Post by steve on Dec 8, 2023 8:07:08 GMT
Some local election news I was involved with
Harpenden Rural Herts County council
Allison Frances Wren (Liberal Democrats) 1474 58% Elected
Claudio Duran (Conservative) 766 30% Not elected
Symon Vegro (Labour) 168 7% Not elected
Mario May (Green Party) 119 5% Not elected
This was a win from the Tories for us welcome to the team Dr Allison Wren.
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Post by Danny on Dec 8, 2023 8:14:58 GMT
Rwanda direct costs now up to £290 million for, er, zero refugees deported. I dont think that includes costs of housing the people here whose processing is awaiting the option to deport them.
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Post by EmCat on Dec 8, 2023 8:15:40 GMT
The Rwandan scheme has more than doubled in cost to £290m and not a single asylum seeker sent there or likely to be sent there The Tax payer is being bled dry On the other hand, the Rwandan GDP has been boosted by around 3% (a quick search shows latest GDP for Rwanda was just over $11,000,000,000, or £8.8bn at current exchange rates) |
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Post by neilj on Dec 8, 2023 8:17:42 GMT
The Rwandan scheme has more than doubled in cost to £290m and not a single asylum seeker sent there or likely to be sent there The Tax payer is being bled dry On the other hand, the Rwandan GDP has been boosted by around 3% (a quick search shows latest GDP for Rwanda was just over $11,000,000,000, or £8.8bn at current exchange rates) I suppose the Government could say it's reparations for the colonial era 😀 |
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Post by birdseye on Dec 8, 2023 8:18:10 GMT
Most of our recent inflation was caused by corporate greed. Carsten Jung, head of economics at the IPPR, said the work of Isabella Weber, an economist at the University of Massachusetts, showed how “systemic sectors” can have an outsized impact on inflation across the wider economy.
The report echoes research by the Unite union, which last year revealed how the biggest price increases affecting the UK consumer prices index (CPI) were driven by firms that either maintained or improved their profit margins.
Among the companies that increased their profits most from the pre-pandemic average were:
ExxonMobil: profits of £15bn increased to £53bn
Shell: £16bn up to £44bn
Glencore: £1.9 bn up to £14.8bn
Archer-Daniels-Midland: £1.4bn up to £3.16bn
Kraft Heinz: £265m up to £1.8bnHigher taxes on corporate profits are needed now. The problem is that UK branches of multinationals generally make little profit. This is because profits are redirected to their head offices via loan repayments, payments for use of the brand and so on. I can see two possible solutions (there may well be others of course): 1) Every country in the world signs up to a minimum level of tax on profits. Fat chance. If even one country however small refused to sign up it would immediately become the head office location of every multinational. 2) Tax turnover in the UK. This could be done, but it would be very complicated because every industry has a different level of profit margin. Supermarkets are usually quite low (in the region of 5% I believe) whereas international consultant firms for instance would have a much higher margin. Therefore a different level of turnover tax would be needed for each industry unless it was made very low and even then it would penalise supermarkets more than consultants in my example. And of course the tax would be passed on to the consumer. There is a third solution. Unlike most other nations we do not take national interest into consideration when a foreign company takes over a British one. All the City wants is as much commission as possible. So stop the "everything is for sale " approach and keep far more companies under British ownership and paying taxes on their full profits in the UK. |
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