neilj
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Post by neilj on Aug 28, 2022 5:53:21 GMT
Re 'Liz Truss considers ‘nuclear’ option of five per cent VAT cut Largest ever reduction could save families £1,300 a year in £38bn boost to economy'
I have seen the reports but not how they worked it out Average house hold incone in the UK was £31,400 in financial year ending 2021(poorer households a lot less than that) So if you spent every penny you earn on vat rated goods you would save £1,570. However vat is not payable on rent or mortgage payments. Nor on most food items, education, children's clothes,most cultural and sporting activities. Obviously you don't pay vat on savings or increased pension payments. Nor on student loan payments or health. Nor do you pay uk vat on flights or of course on what you spend while you are abroad.
I suspect the real figure for savings would be under £400 a year. Even that figure supposes you spend £8,000 a year on vat rated goods. To get to the savings of £1,300 a year you would have to pay £26,000 on vat rated goods!
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Post by jimjam on Aug 28, 2022 5:54:02 GMT
ON - People can be members of the SDLP and Labour Party at the same time such is the link and many are.
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Post by alec on Aug 28, 2022 6:37:01 GMT
Just me, or do others get jumpy when they read "'Liz Truss considers ‘nuclear’ option..."?
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Post by crossbat11 on Aug 28, 2022 7:03:20 GMT
Just me, or do others get jumpy when they read "'Liz Truss considers ‘nuclear’ option..."? Well, she has already, hasn't she? I mean the real nuclear option not some journalistic cliche about fanciful VAT cuts. And she rather relishes it too, I gather.
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Post by bardin1 on Aug 28, 2022 7:09:02 GMT
A bit more on the possible plans of Truss, this time in The Times: “ Allies of the frontrunner for the Tory leadership believe that the personal allowance, the level above which people begin paying income tax, should be lifted several years ahead of the Treasury’s schedule. It is £12,570 at present.
Others in her team have proposed raising the point at which people tip into the higher rate of tax, 40 per cent, which now stands at £50,270. They are also considering cutting the basic rate below 20 per cent.
The first two measures would help to address the problem of fiscal drag, in which millions of taxpayers have been pulled into higher bands by rampant inflation.
While critics are likely to argue that the cuts would lead to billions of pounds of extra borrowing and further fuel inflation, a Truss ally said that Rishi Sunak had already drawn up plans to cut income tax by 2p by 2024. While personal allowances and income tax thresholds typically rise in line with inflation, last year Sunak was accused of imposing a £21 billion “stealth tax” after he chose to freeze the personal allowance and higher rate threshold for four years.”
…
“The Centre for Social Justice think tank, founded by the Truss backer Sir Iain Duncan Smith, is proposing significantly increasing universal credit from October to give 8.5 million households an additional £219 on average over a three-month period.” This has all the hallmarks of someone without a thought of there own, with a group of young politicos around them grasping at any idea which into the 'low taxes' mantra. Of the ideas, though the obvious one which would help everyone, but especially those most likely to be unable to pay the additional fuel costs, would be raising the basic threshold for paying tax. I hope that prevails as it would genuinely help the low paid and those on benefits which cross the tax threshold. I would think nearly all of it would come back into the economy as well, certainly far more than cuts for those earning over £50k
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Post by jib on Aug 28, 2022 7:17:24 GMT
Very difficult winter ahead and it's frightening that so many will struggle to provide a basic need - warmth in a cold climate.
This is Government failure on an epic scale, and the rot set in the Tory - Lib Dem coalition when Sir Ed Davey flip flopped over fracking and promises of a new series of nuclear power stations (including one in Anglesey near me) came to nothing.
Theresa May, then Boris Johnson - same again. No strategy and little delivery of an energy masterplan and the ridiculous concept of heat pumps. Apparently now cheaper to run petrol cars than electric ones as well.
What a mess. But the root causes that mean it is so bad in the UK are political and start in 2010.
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Post by crossbat11 on Aug 28, 2022 7:23:55 GMT
crossbat11 re Cricket. It’s not really a class thing but more that Cricket seems linked (for me) to British (English) exceptionalism and Empire, something I’d rather were forgotten. But then I even think it’s ridiculous that we never moved to driving on the right (and in fact downright dangerous considering the large number of Britons driving on the continent and vice versa). Sweden switched over in the 60s I believe. As pjw1961 pointed out, there is very little of that sort of mentality remaining in the game now outside of the Long Room at Lords and the odd county cricket committee room. Yorkshire CCC may be one such place. You're right of course that the growth of cricket outside of its birthplace in England is a legacy of Empire, but that hangover is all but gone. It thrives in India, Pakistan, Australia, South Africa, NZ etc in its own right. The downside of this limited growth and spread of the game beyond the old colonial countries is that it hasn't really become a global game in the true sense of the word. It's played seriously in only about seven or eight countries in the world, albeit in some very populous ones! India accounts for about 15% of the world's total population. My essential point though was about the demographic shrivelling of the game in this country. Rather like Rugby Union, its almost total disappearance from state schools and factories, means that it has gradually become, essentially, a middle class game. There are of course exceptions, but I've noticed, from being inside the game as a player and spectator all my adult life, its slow gentrification. I think that's a real shame too.
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 28, 2022 7:35:23 GMT
The callous disregard to suffering from the regime doesn't just extend to vast numbers in the UK resident population but to the fate of refugees from Ukraine here as well.
It's estimated 20,000 will find themselves homeless by Christmas while no additional support at all had been offered to the families who 50,000 in after the first six month period ends.
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 28, 2022 7:38:43 GMT
crossbat11 There's plenty of old school tie influence in cricket, it hasn't changed over half the current team are public school educated. Admittedly this doesn't include the current England captain, probably because he's actually from New Zealand.
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Post by crossbat11 on Aug 28, 2022 7:56:17 GMT
crossbat11 There's plenty of old school tie influence in cricket, it hasn't changed over half the current team are public school educated. Admittedly this doesn't include the current England captain, probably because he's actually from New Zealand. Yes, the days of whistling down mineshafts to find England's next great fast bowler, a la Harold Larwood, have long gone. I accept too that maybe English cricket was always a bit gentrified at its upper administrative and playing levels ( Gentlemen and Players having different entrance gates to the playing area and all that) but up until about the 1980s there were very healthy numbers of white working class people playing and watching the game too. Some still are but in worryingly fewer numbers. A lot of clubs are sustained now by their local Asian populations. That's great because they felt excluded until fairly recently, but they are filling a void left by far fewer young white working class people taking up the game. Another sad development is the almost total disappearance of second and third generation Afro- Caribbean people playing and watching the game in this country now. They just aren't there any longer. No more heaving calypso hordes on the old Rea Bank at Edgbaston to cheer on touring West Indian sides. No more wonderfully convivial games against the Redditch West Indies side either. Runs or wickets was their mantra. No dot balls tolerated. The side ceased to exist in the early 80s. Great days and characters long gone.
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 28, 2022 8:06:24 GMT
crossbat11 In 2020 9 out the 11 players playing Pakistan went to public school, despite the fact just 6% of the population did. Public schools also have a tradition of trawling club cricket in order to gather new players via scholarships. The disparity of resources is huge Eton has around the same number of students as a large comprehensive and where a comprehensive might have a shared facility suitable for use as a cricket pitch Eton has twenty two! In 1987-88, of the 13 players who represented England on a tour of Pakistan, only one had attended a private school.
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Post by wb61 on Aug 28, 2022 8:19:19 GMT
We are away at Twinwood Festival, not a hotbed of Socialism as a vintage weekend with lots of money floating around. That context is important because what my wife overheard from a group of about 8 ages ranging from 40 to 60 who were quite openly saying that if things didn't change and soon they would become involved in revolution. This was in the morning with cups of tea not beer in front of them. After reading about the Corbyn chants at Old Trafford it seemed to me these may be straws in the wind for what is coming in public opinion. Of course I don't expect revolution but that depth of feeling in the need for radical change must have its outlet somewhere
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 28, 2022 8:20:07 GMT
jib You are very keen on blaming the 56 liberal democrats members of the coalition and disregarding the 306 Tories. I wonder why that could be? The root cause of the rot in UK politics started far earlier than 2010 When the republican party in the U.S. and the Thatcher Tories abandoned the post war consensus and embarked on their reverse Robin Hood objectives of stealing from the poor and giving to the rich.
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Post by crossbat11 on Aug 28, 2022 8:23:21 GMT
crossbat11 In 2020 9 out the 11 players playing Pakistan went to public school, despite the fact just 6% of the population did. Public schools also have a tradition of trawling club cricket in order to gather new players via scholarships. The disparity of resources is huge Eton has around the same number of students as a large comprehensive and where a comprehensive might have a shared facility suitable for use as a cricket pitch Eton has twenty two! In 1987-88, of the 13 players who represented England on a tour of Pakistan, only one had attended a private school. As an ex public schoolboy in the 1970s, I'm well aware of the disparity with state schools in terms of sporting facilities and resources, Steve. Cricket is a unique game in terms of not only the amount of time required to play it but also the care and maintenance needed to keep a manicured cricket square in playable condition. No jumpers for goalposts. You can't just rock up to a patch of grass and put a few stumps in the ground and play a game of cricket. Well, not a decent one, anyway! Equipment is expensive too. I think all these factors have worked against the game in state schools. Summer terms are subsumed by exams these days and there isn't enough expertise and resource to dedicate to the hours required by cricket. Public schools have no such qualms or restrictions. There are undoubtedly other factors at play, and you make a good point about public schools giving promising young cricketers scholarships. Joe Root and Zac Crawley are two such examples, I think. However, the preponderance of public school educated cricketers playing the professional game in this country is, I think, another example of the demographic shrivelling that has taken place over the last 30-40 years and that I have been referring to in previous posts.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2022 8:28:24 GMT
crossbat11 In 2020 9 out the 11 players playing Pakistan went to public school, despite the fact just 6% of the population did. Public schools also have a tradition of trawling club cricket in order to gather new players via scholarships. The disparity of resources is huge Eton has around the same number of students as a large comprehensive and where a comprehensive might have a shared facility suitable for use as a cricket pitch Eton has twenty two! In 1987-88, of the 13 players who represented England on a tour of Pakistan, only one had attended a private school. As an ex public schoolboy in the 1970s, I'm well aware of the disparity with state schools in terms of sporting facilities and resources, Steve. Cricket is a unique game in terms of not only the amount of time required to play it but also the care and maintenance needed to keep a manicured cricket square in playable condition. No jumpers for goalposts. You can't just rock up to a patch of grass and put a few stumps in the ground and play a game of cricket. Well, not a decent one, anyway! Equipment is expensive too. I think all these factors have worked against the game in state schools. Summer terms are subsumed by exams these days and there isn't enough expertise and resource to dedicate to the hours required by cricket. Public schools have no such qualms or restrictions. There are undoubtedly other factors at play, and you make a good point about public schools giving promising young cricketers scholarships. Joe Root and Zac Crawley are two such examples, I think. However, the preponderance of public school educated cricketers playing the professional game in this country is, I think, another example of the demographic shrivelling that has taken place over the last 30-40 years and that I have been referring to in previous posts. Central contracts for international players don't help. There just isn't any grass roots any more to select players from. The pool shrinks. Cricket in the UK has basically committed a long slow suicide that sort of mirrors the larger economy.
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Post by bedknobsandboomstick on Aug 28, 2022 8:46:23 GMT
Have been away and pondering on the energy crisis. I can't help feeling that what we are seeing is the end point of the neo-liberal orthodoxy that has dominated economic and political thinking for far too long now. When inflation hits, 'common sense' dictates that working men and women should accept below inflation pay rises, otherwise inflation bites. When the banks crash and the government bails them out, working men and women have to accept lower public spending and higher taxes, because reducing public debt is 'common sense'. In an external energy price shock, if the government wants to keep prices down, then it's 'common sense' that the costs should ultimately be borne by consumers through higher future bills and through some complex tax on profits that allows multiple loopholes to reduce the cost to business owners. At no point in any of this is the legitimacy of the market pricing mechanism questioned, as neo-liberal orthodoxy dictates that market mechanisms are sacrosanct. This is a relatively recent attitude. During the war years it was seen as a criminal activity to manipulate prices and exploit shortages for financial gain, and right up until the early 1960s there was legislation previously supported by both Labour and Conservatives to prevent landowners getting excess gains from the sale of development land. In the 1970s inflationary shock, price controls were used and were not seen as constitutionally outrageous. I've been away, and not following news stories that closely, so may have missed something, but what I'm not seeing here is any kind of forensic examination of why we are seeing price gouging on a massive scale in the domestic energy production market. I heard one analyst suggest that because domestic renewable generators have not seen their costs rise, the government should negotiate lower price contracts with them, but this is a weak response, based on conventional market operations. Logically, domestic renewable energy and UK oil and gas production has not experienced excessive input cost inflation, (some cost pressures, but not huge) yet they are selling their output at the massively inflated unit costs set by global commodity markets. I can't see any reason why a sovereign government doesn't legislate to cap wholesale energy prices for UK produced energy to benchmark levels based on 2021 prices plus a modest inflation uplift to take account of the general inflation rise. This would keep consumers and businesses from bankruptcy and destitution, keep general inflation down, and would not require high costs to the government or to future bill payers. It would affect energy producers profits, which would be forced to remain normal, and so shareholders wouldn't be in for such an unwarranted bonanza, and it just seems such a simple, 'common sense' thing to do. That neither Labour or Tories are talking about capping wholesale prices is a sign of how deep the neo-liberalism now runs. Approaches that were previously considered perfectly acceptable in certain circumstances are now deemed beyond the pale, and this is something I really think we need to fight very hard against. One of the greatest mistakes of Thatcherism was to confuse the completely acceptable business motivation of profit seeking with a mantra of profit maximisation, something that can be counter productive and which should, in a functioning democratic system, be controlled. There is no excuse for UK wind energy prices to be rising alongside global gas prices, and this is basic price gouging. We are inventing all manner of complex initiatives to sidestep these price rises, the cost of which will ultimately fall on consumers and taxpayers, except for the one simple measure of forcing limits to price gouging on the parts of the wholesale energy market that we can control. Very thought provocing Alec. Isn't the energy price at the moment reflective of a blend of sources though, so wind etc are still charging at their normal rate? Regardless of this detail, it seems to me that all the extra money has to be going into the coffers of the gas production companies. Given that we are still a major prodcer of natural gas (although not enough to fully meet our needs), it seems to me that the easiest solution would be to set up a windfall tax on UK gas production related to the wholesale price. If the price goes up, so does the tax, partly insulating us from it. The producers would be allowed to make a suitable profit of course. This doesn't seem greatly different to the function of Ofgem in regulating the profits made by consumer suppliers.
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Post by kay9 on Aug 28, 2022 8:48:25 GMT
ON - People can be members of the SDLP and Labour Party at the same time such is the link and many are. If I remember correctly, ON’s point was that under a proposed change to the LP rules, no link would be allowed to a “Nationalist” party. Again, as I understand it, the SDLP advocates the breakup of the UK by constitutional means. I know that the SNP advocates the breakup of the UK by constitutional means. So if the proposed change to LP rules is aimed at the SNP, then how does it exclude the SDLP? Or, if the ‘link’ you mention is strong enough to withstand this change in LP rules, then how can it be used against the Scottish NATIONAL Party? (capitals for BJ’s sake)
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Post by shevii on Aug 28, 2022 8:55:49 GMT
Re 'Liz Truss considers ‘nuclear’ option of five per cent VAT cut Largest ever reduction could save families £1,300 a year in £38bn boost to economy' I have seen the reports but not how they worked it out Average house hold incone in the UK was £31,400 in financial year ending 2021(poorer households a lot less than that) So if you spent every penny you earn on vat rated goods you would save £1,570. However vat is not payable on rent or mortgage payments. Nor on most food items, education, children's clothes,most cultural and sporting activities. Obviously you don't pay vat on savings or increased pension payments. Nor on student loan payments or health. Nor do you pay uk vat on flights or of course on what you spend while you are abroad. I suspect the real figure for savings would be under £400 a year. Even that figure supposes you spend £8,000 a year on vat rated goods. To get to the savings of £1,300 a year you would have to pay £26,000 on vat rated goods! Maybe she gets to this average figure because the wealthy spend more on Vatable items? VAT may be a regressive tax as a percentage of income but doesn't mean there aren't big savings to be made by the wealthy for their big ticket items. The cost of living crisis is largely about food, energy and rents which are the key costs that need fixing, so the existing 5% on domestic energy and basically what can be 0% on food aren't going to solve this crisis using VAT cuts.
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oldnat
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Post by oldnat on Aug 28, 2022 8:59:02 GMT
ON - People can be members of the SDLP and Labour Party at the same time such is the link and many are. Presumably that is because, currently, those SDLP members are not "are not members of political parties or organisations ancillary or subsidiary thereto declared by Party conference or by the NEC in pursuance of Party conference decisions to be ineligible for affiliation to the Party".
So, either the report on the proposed constitutional amendment is in error (quite possible), or Conference/NEC is going to have to select which "other" Nationalist parties are to be proscribed, and which are to be acceptable, or the proposed amendment is simply ill thought out posturing.
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Post by alec on Aug 28, 2022 9:02:28 GMT
Germany way ahead of us -
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2022 9:05:50 GMT
SSAP24 was far too vague . And abused. FRS17 forced companies to recognise the cost of the promise to pay a future pension related to then pay-and indexed. There is a calculable present value for that as there is for the future income stream from contributions. Triennial actuarial valuations provide both and forced companies to properkly account for fund deficits-and/or do something about them. Pity Governments dont have to do the same thing. FRS17 was more correct in 'purist' accounting terms but its social effects were disastrous, leading to massive retrograde steps in company pension provision from which we have not recovered. And the same accounting bodies were happy not long afterward to allow banks to vastly overstate the value of the complex financial instruments packaging and repackaging sub-prime loans in their books, leading directly to the financial crash of 2008. Where was their accounting purity then? I would hazard a guess that if a SSAP24 style regime had been maintained, few of the old pension schemes would have actually got into difficulties - it is the theoretical future deficits that have driven company behaviour and that is not the purpose of accounting rules to my mind. By the way, point of detail - the Local Government Pension schemes are funded schemes, not pay as you go as with a lot of the central government schemes, so that distinction should be noted. I will leave you to believe that 0.2% of government expenditure represents a serious threat to the UK economy if you wish. I don't consider a reform to pension fund liability accounting which stopped companies taking pension contribution "holidays" to boost flagging profits , an exercise in "purism" . Legally binding promises to pay employees pensions as a % of future salaries-and index those payments for life are expensive. You don't need to analyse the complexity of FRS17-just ask a new pensioner with a DC pot how much it costs to buy an indexed annuity as opposed to a flat payment. A search of annuity rates this morning suggests that a 65 year old male will have to reduce a level rate by 30% to get 3% pa escalation. For a 60 year old it is 35% Yes the accounting bodies were criticised for their part in the 2007 credit crash, along with credit agencies and the failed UK Tripartite Financial Regulation regime. EY was sued in USA for it part in the Lehman failure. I would have thought that this episode was a reminder that companies should be held to strict rules for accounting for their liabilities.Not to plead for less "purity". The 2011 Public Service pension reforms have shifted state funding of unfunded public service pension from the "top up" column to the "Departmental pension contribution column". It is the total "employer" cost which is relevant. The NAO March 2021 Report on Public Service Pensions says that this is 2% of GDP ( across all public service pensions)-ergo about 4.5% of Total Managed Expenditure. THis report also identifies :- " 105% real-terms increase in total benefits paid annually over the past 20 years across the four largest pay-as-you-go schemes (the armed forces, civil service, NHS and teachers’ pension schemes)" "16%real-terms increase over the past 20 years in the average annual pension paid (excluding lump sum payments) by the four largest pay-as-you-go schemes" Yes the 2011 reforms, including increased employee contributions ,will reduce these escalations. NAO say that total cost of 2% of GDP will fall to 1.5% by 2065
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Aug 28, 2022 9:10:45 GMT
Truss shouldn't bother unpacking when she moves into Number 10
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 28, 2022 9:11:35 GMT
alec Spain is going further. Air conditioning with very few exceptions in public buildings including restaurants and bars is now set at a minimum of 25°, originally it was to be 27 but The hospitality sector went ballistic. The maximum heating levels in the same buildings is set at 17°, which given the higher temperature would be about the equivalent of 13° in the uk.
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Post by Old Southendian on Aug 28, 2022 9:19:28 GMT
Central contracts for international players don't help. There just isn't any grass roots any more to select players from. The pool shrinks. Cricket in the UK has basically committed a long slow suicide that sort of mirrors the larger economy. I find it a little worrying that I'm enjoying this conversation about cricket more than any politics. Perhaps I'm also putting my head in the sand. Nevertheless, here's some thoughts on cricket.
I was a bit surprised about TMS being said to be more public school and middle class than it used to be, but maybe that's right. I was basing my thoughts on when I was younger and it seemed to be dominated by Johnners and Blowers, who, while being undeniably charming, seemed to represent exactly that public school atmosphere that could be off-putting to many, including myself to some extent. I don't find Aggers quite that overbearing, though now I think about it, he is just carrying on the old traditions in a slightly quieter way. And in the old days, there was a balance with some of the more gruff old hands. Nowadays we get Tuffers I guess, but he's more of a down to earth cheeky chappie than a dour old timer. To be honest I think I prefer TMS now to back then, but perhaps that's because I've become more middle class, rather than TMS changing.
As for where cricket went wrong, and why it's declining, yes I'm sure it has a lot to do with school facilities. But I think TV has played a large role too, and poor decisions about free-to-view coverage. Football has clearly played this game far better, though football was always more popular. By having some football still on free-to-view channels, it has kept and grown its audience, while still making sickeningly big sums on the paying channels. I remember a few years ago picking up my daughter from her friend's house, and she wasn't ready yet. In the meantime I sat down and watched some cricket on Sky with her friend's father. I hadn't seen cricket on TV for years, and was really enjoying it, so was disappointed when my daughter finally wanted to go. So I have now watched about 30 minutes of cricket in the last 20 years, while I still often listen to the radio. You can't learn to fully appreciate the game from the radio. I was brought up on watching Sunday one day matches on TV and at Chelmsford/Southend, some 3-day matches and, of course, test matches on the TV every summer holiday. It just doesn't happen like that any more except for enthusiasts, so it's difficult to see how it's going to grow from here.
Having said that, both TV and radio are old media now, and indeed 'live' seems to be an out-dated concept too. But many other sports seem to be growing and using new outlets, but cricket does seem to be stuck in the past. I have no idea how it can solve that problem.
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steve
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Post by steve on Aug 28, 2022 9:19:57 GMT
While for some southern municipalities the heating aspect doesn't really matter as interior temperatures rarely drop below around 15° contrary to expectations here it can get a bit chilly even in popular coastal areas.The Costa Brava and Dorada routinely record single figure temperatures from December to February. Many a cry of me muero de frio expected
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2022 9:20:08 GMT
Logically, domestic renewable energy and UK oil and gas production has not experienced excessive input cost inflation, (some cost pressures, but not huge) yet they are selling their output at the massively inflated unit costs set by global commodity markets. I can't see any reason why a sovereign government doesn't legislate to cap wholesale energy prices for UK produced energy to benchmark levels based on 2021 prices plus a modest inflation uplift to take account of the general inflation rise. There is no excuse for UK wind energy prices to be rising alongside global gas prices, and this is basic price gouging. I agree absolutely alec Kwarteng was reported to be looking at renewable wholesale prices and profits, but I'm not holding my breath. He seems to have drifted away from the SCottish Power 2 year freeze plan. There is something crazy about being substantially free of reliance on Russian sourced gas, but tied to the prices it is engendering in an economic war against Europe. David Smith demolishes Truss' NI reduction in ST. Sunak already dropped the threshold so she will give this money to the rich and to companies. Mind you , no one is talking about Business energy prices. They aren't capped. ST has forecasts of 500k jobs and 10k businesses in hospitality, at risk.Farms, Hotels, Fish and chip shops, Garden Centres and Nurseries. 1500% increases are documented. ST relates a Nursery in Essex which has seen its bill go from £1m pa to a 2023 forecast of £14.6 m -three times their annual sales. Closure and 150 jobs in prospect. Truss hasn't seen the half of it yet. Brearley of OFGEM says the crisis is too big for them to control.
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oldnat
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Post by oldnat on Aug 28, 2022 9:20:40 GMT
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Post by jib on Aug 28, 2022 9:23:33 GMT
jib You are very keen on blaming the 56 liberal democrats members of the coalition and disregarding the 306 Tories. I wonder why that could be? The root cause of the rot in UK politics started far earlier than 2010 When the republican party in the U.S. and the Thatcher Tories abandoned the post war consensus and embarked on their reverse Robin Hood objectives of stealing from the poor and giving to the rich. I wasn't blaming the Lib Dems specifically, but I would note they did partake quite willingly is in the disemboweling of the UK public sector from 2010-15. Sometimes you don't need to take money from the poor, just take the institutions of state that they rely on away from them. The current energy crisis has been a long time coming. The reason that France can keep energy costs low is that they have something like 80% nuclear derived electric, which only needs more Uranium fuel really. Heaven knows what the UKs "decentralised" "market led" system has. A lot of prematurely shut coal fired power stations being rapidly refurbed from what I hear.
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Post by matt126 on Aug 28, 2022 9:34:45 GMT
Re 'Liz Truss considers ‘nuclear’ option of five per cent VAT cut Largest ever reduction could save families £1,300 a year in £38bn boost to economy' I have seen the reports but not how they worked it out Average house hold incone in the UK was £31,400 in financial year ending 2021(poorer households a lot less than that) So if you spent every penny you earn on vat rated goods you would save £1,570. However vat is not payable on rent or mortgage payments. Nor on most food items, education, children's clothes,most cultural and sporting activities. Obviously you don't pay vat on savings or increased pension payments. Nor on student loan payments or health. Nor do you pay uk vat on flights or of course on what you spend while you are abroad. I suspect the real figure for savings would be under £400 a year. Even that figure supposes you spend £8,000 a year on vat rated goods. To get to the savings of £1,300 a year you would have to pay £26,000 on vat rated goods! Apparently the VAT cut would cost 3 Billon a month. I suspect most households would not see the quoted figures which are fake. Most household expenditure is on essential items like food which are not vatable. II would think that most of the VAT expenditure is via business transactions so it might reduce the costs of a lot of businesses but households would not see direct benefits as they would with fuel subsidies.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2022 9:35:16 GMT
Stewart Lee in the Guardian:
"But remember Brexit Britain, as you crawl from the sea coated from head to toe in human excrement, it’s what you voted for! Freedom from their red tape! We may be swimming in shit, but at least it’s the shit of Britons unbowed by the yoke of Brussels! Where will this bonanza of post-Brexit deregulation take us next?"
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