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Post by alec on May 16, 2022 13:30:51 GMT
lens - "Pots, kettles, black, Alec? Couldn't we maybe draw attention to those on social media who cherry pick the "studies" they quote to reflect the most pessimistic view? Who cite grossly exaggerated risks due to Covid? (And before you say it, I'm not denying the real and terrible effects Covid genuinely has caused - just pleading for some perspective and proportion.)" No Lens, all I am doing is pleading for some perspective and proportion. And that link from the Guardian is an extreme misreading of the science that has been widely debunked by those pleading for perspective etc etc.
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Post by alec on May 16, 2022 13:52:08 GMT
lens - "And your scepticism about "excess deaths" just doesn't stand up to criticism. So what if a given death is down to Covid or" some other respiratory disease? Do you seriously think it would bother me on my deathbed if the doctor said "well, I'm afraid you are going to die shortly, but the really good news is that it's not Covid!!) Does it really surprise you that the UK has a higher than world average death rate for respiratory illnesses, given the climate? You may be surprised to hear that conversely we are well off for such as a low rate of malaria deaths?" That's a total cognitive failure, to be honest. As many experts (yes, proper ones) have pointed out, it really does stand up to criticism. No, the UK's record on respiratory deaths is not a factor of climate, as many other countries have similar climates and widely divergent health outcomes. And really, yes - if you have poor outcomes on respiratory health in normal times, the effects of suppressing infections will be greater. Doh! So the UK has, for example, the third worst record for asthma prevalence in the world (see www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3353191/ ) Asthma + infectious respiratory infection = enhanced chance of death. So when covid comes along and people with asthma take brilliantly successful measures to protect themselves against infection, like mask wearing, social distancing, lockdowns, etc, they will also protect themselves against every other infection that could kill an asthma sufferer, and the fall in deaths here will be greater than elsewhere, because of our worse asthma rates. And therefore the excess deaths figure may not give an accurate picture of the comparative performance on covid containment. The last available data on the covid dashboard has Deaths within 28 days of positive test of 1389, so that's 1389 deaths with a brand new pathogen never before known to exist, yet the excess deaths are meant to be below normal. I'm afraid it doesn't take a genius level of IQ to work out that if 1389 people have died from a new disease yet deaths are lower than normal, something is skewing the figures. I'm afraid you are falling into the covid minimizers camp, refusing to look at the data, following the herd and angrily accusing those quietly telling the truth of being some kind of extremists.That has never worked with me I'm afraid. I will continue to flag up where you are all going wrong, by looking at the science, the numbers, and and data. And so far on covid, the people I cite have been right at every turn, and people like you have been consistently wrong.
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neilj
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Post by neilj on May 16, 2022 14:29:51 GMT
Why on earth is Johnson trying to change the NIP when he said it was a 'brilliant ' deal with no checks between Northern Ireland and the RUK, you might almost think he was lying...
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on May 16, 2022 14:53:18 GMT
From the Michael Young article linked earlier...
“Underpinning my argument was a non-controversial historical analysis of what had been happening to society for more than a century before 1958, and most emphatically since the 1870s, when schooling was made compulsory and competitive entry to the civil service became the rule.
Until that time status was generally ascribed by birth. But irrespective of people's birth, status has gradually become more achievable.
It is good sense to appoint individual people to jobs on their merit. It is the opposite when those who are judged to have merit of a particular kind harden into a new social class without room in it for others.
Ability of a conventional kind, which used to be distributed between the classes more or less at random, has become much more highly concentrated by the engine of education.
A social revolution has been accomplished by harnessing schools and universities to the task of sieving people according to education's narrow band of values.
With an amazing battery of certificates and degrees at its disposal, education has put its seal of approval on a minority, and its seal of disapproval on the many who fail to shine from the time they are relegated to the bottom streams at the age of seven or before.
The new class has the means at hand, and largely under its control, by which it reproduces itself.”
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oldnat
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Post by oldnat on May 16, 2022 14:54:35 GMT
Tory MPs sitting determinedly down, so as to prevent questions being asked about Levelling Up.
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2022 14:59:57 GMT
I don't normally comment on matters fussball as I know little on the subject but Abingdon Town football club in Oxon is almost next to the Thames, or Isis as you might want to call it round here. Knowing nothing about a subject is hardly a disqualification for posting on here. Note the recent armchair generalship. I used to spend much time in Abingdon -- pretty ghastly place -- but never realised it was a mile or two from Sutton Courtenay where Orwell is buried. I know it's wacky but I would have liked to have gone to his grave. You get two for the price of one, as Asquith is buried there. I also visited Marcel Carnet's grave in Monmatre. He is buried next to his long-time partner. People leave metro tickets on the grave for a quirky reason. Identifying allied war graves in churchyards has been good for tourism, I believe that when Asquith went to the Lords, he actually took the somewhat unusual title of 1st Earl of Oxford and Asquith. Abingdon was also the birthplace of my own Isa, being the home of the MG car company back in the day. |
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domjg
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Post by domjg on May 16, 2022 15:15:43 GMT
Knowing nothing about a subject is hardly a disqualification for posting on here. Note the recent armchair generalship. I used to spend much time in Abingdon -- pretty ghastly place -- but never realised it was a mile or two from Sutton Courtenay where Orwell is buried. I know it's wacky but I would have liked to have gone to his grave. You get two for the price of one, as Asquith is buried there. I also visited Marcel Carnet's grave in Monmatre. He is buried next to his long-time partner. People leave metro tickets on the grave for a quirky reason. Identifying allied war graves in churchyards has been good for tourism, I believe that when Asquith went to the Lords, he actually took the somewhat unusual title of 1st Earl of Oxford and Asquith. Abingdon was also the birthplace of my own Isa, being the home of the MG car company back in the day. "Abingdon was also the birthplace of my own Isa, being the home of the MG car company back in the day" - Yup, site's a Waitrose and care home now you'll be pleased to know! Correction: that's where the brewery and train station were. Seems the MG factory was further west in the town |
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Post by mercian on May 16, 2022 15:17:54 GMT
It's a shame to be so curmudgeonly about a celebration that will give a lot of people pleasure in these difficult times and Her Majesty deserves respect for the way she has conducted herself for 70 years on the throne. Even at 96 she is still carrying out some of her duties which is both remarkable and admirable. I expect you all to pile in with snide comments but I had to respond to the miserable fun-hating that is so typical of the left. Truly the spirit of the Cromwell and the major-generals. I suppose we should ban Maypole dancing and Christmas too? Rather than Cromwell, I prefer Thomas Rainsborough's observation in the Putney Debates (although these days it would encompass she's as well as he's): "I think that the poorest he that is in England hath a life to live, as the greatest he; and therefore truly, Sir, I think it's clear, that every man that is to live under a government ought first by his own consent to put himself under that government; and I do think that the poorest man in England is not bound in a strict sense to that government that he hath not had a voice to put himself under." I have no voice in selecting the Monarch, therefore I do not consider myself bound to recognise the existence of that institution or regard myself as a subject of it. For the avoidance of doubt, Rainsborough was calling for universal male suffrage in 1648 - it wasn't finally achieved until 1918, and we are still stuck with an unelected head of state. A good argument for Brexit! |
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Post by mercian on May 16, 2022 15:33:25 GMT
oldnat What does she anticipate could happen to those fans if they are pursued? It isn't (yet) a crime to be a republican. If it is we're both buggered. mercian It's the least we could expect that an individual paid 15 times as much as the president of the United States and who didn't pay tax at all until they were 68 were adequate at what passes for their job. Nice old lady that Mrs Windsor might be she doesn't deserve respect simply for living a long time. No, she deserves respect for working hard all her life for the benefit of the country. It wasn't me that said that. |
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Post by Old Southendian on May 16, 2022 15:38:36 GMT
I don't normally comment on matters fussball as I know little on the subject but Abingdon Town football club in Oxon is almost next to the Thames, or Isis as you might want to call it round here. Knowing Abingdon a bit, I guess it's also occasionally under the Thames. In the floodplain, isn't it? So it'll probably have houses on it in a few years. |
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Post by mercian on May 16, 2022 15:42:37 GMT
Pedant alert : I believe Stockport County's home ground is known as Edgeley Park (without an 'r'). And by way of embracing robbiealive 's footie indulgence above, I offer a little football trivia question for Monday morning to sharpen the little grey cells. I believe this still to be accurate, but will gladly acknowledge if it is not. Which two teams played in front of the biggest postwar FA Cup crowd outside of Wembley? I could well be wrong, but might one of them be Charlton? |
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domjg
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Post by domjg on May 16, 2022 15:48:13 GMT
I don't normally comment on matters fussball as I know little on the subject but Abingdon Town football club in Oxon is almost next to the Thames, or Isis as you might want to call it round here. Knowing Abingdon a bit, I guess it's also occasionally under the Thames. In the floodplain, isn't it? So it'll probably have houses on it in a few years. Bits of it though most of the floodplain is south and east of the river which is not really built on. When the Thames is high it's the south of Oxford that suffers the most. |
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2022 16:00:35 GMT
Pedant alert : I believe Stockport County's home ground is known as Edgeley Park (without an 'r'). And by way of embracing robbiealive 's footie indulgence above, I offer a little football trivia question for Monday morning to sharpen the little grey cells. I believe this still to be accurate, but will gladly acknowledge if it is not. Which two teams played in front of the biggest postwar FA Cup crowd outside of Wembley? I could well be wrong, but might one of them be Charlton? I'm afraid you are wrong, although I can see why you might have suggested it. The Valley was indeed the largest capacity club ground in England at one time, I believe. You are thinking along the right lines, though. One of the clubs is very easy to guess, the other very much not so! |
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Post by jimjam on May 16, 2022 16:02:52 GMT
Westminster Voting Intention (15 May):
Labour 39% (–)
Conservative 35% (+2)
Liberal Democrat 12% (–)
Green 6% (-1)
Scottish National Party 4% (-1)
Reform UK 3% (+1)
Other 1% (–)
Changes +/- 8 May
redfieldandwiltonstrategies.com/latest-gb-voti… pic.twitter.com/llPkaIPfMh
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domjg
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Post by domjg on May 16, 2022 16:14:37 GMT
@isa I actually have a (sort of) MG myself, one of the last SAIC MG badged MG6's of which there are very few on the road (probably for good reason in a lot of cases). They were designed at and had final assembly at Longbridge though constructed initially in kit form in China and shipped from there. Later 'MG's are of completely Chinese manufacture.
Touch wood it's been a great car which won awards for it's handling which is indeed very good for a car of it's size. Parts can be a bit hard to come by though. Ironically it went to the garage this morning as the electrics started playing up..
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2022 16:14:52 GMT
Westminster Voting Intention (15 May): Labour 39% (–) Conservative 35% (+2) Liberal Democrat 12% (–) Green 6% (-1) Scottish National Party 4% (-1) Reform UK 3% (+1) Other 1% (–) Changes +/- 8 May redfieldandwiltonstrategies.com/latest-gb-voti… pic.twitter.com/llPkaIPfMh CON up 2% in a week is a little surprising to me. Beergate bounce? CON support appears to be firming up a tad at 33/34% ish in recent polls. No sign of it heading south to 30% at this stage. |
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Post by guymonde on May 16, 2022 16:15:10 GMT
Anyone closer than Fulham? I always remember the Boat Race going past Craven Cottage although I've never visited the ground. I was there when Martyn Busby had his leg broken in '72. He was an amazing young prospect, who eventually recovered, but was never the same scintillating player. I used to go to QPR in the late 70s and singing One Martyn Busby, There's only one Martyn Busby (thank God), One Martyn Busby, There's only one Martyn Busby. But our favourite was Don Shanks |
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Post by guymonde on May 16, 2022 16:19:24 GMT
I'll go for Griffin Park (not sure if brentford are still there but last time I was there, with a bunch of Germans over for the World darts event, we nearly fell in the Thames on our way back from the pub) Griffin Park is no more, but Brentford Community Stadium is much nearer the Thames. However the new stand at Craven Cottage appears to actually be cantilevered over the Thames. I rather doubt that Atletico Lechlade can beat that |
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domjg
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Post by domjg on May 16, 2022 16:23:08 GMT
Westminster Voting Intention (15 May): Labour 39% (–) Conservative 35% (+2) Liberal Democrat 12% (–) Green 6% (-1) Scottish National Party 4% (-1) Reform UK 3% (+1) Other 1% (–) Changes +/- 8 May redfieldandwiltonstrategies.com/latest-gb-voti… pic.twitter.com/llPkaIPfMh CON up 2% in a week is a little surprising to me. Beergate bounce? CON support appears to be firming up a tad at 33/34% ish in recent polls. No sign of it heading south to 30% at this stage. Hope to God it's got nothing to do with Johnson's absurd posturing over the NIP, to realise some voters were THAT naive and manipulable really would be depressing.. Can't really understand how they're on 35% but I reckon that's their new high water mark and they'll never go over that again with Johnson as leader. |
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Post by crossbat11 on May 16, 2022 16:28:31 GMT
CON up 2% in a week is a little surprising to me. Beergate bounce? CON support appears to be firming up a tad at 33/34% ish in recent polls. No sign of it heading south to 30% at this stage. Hope to God it's got nothing to do with Johnson's absurd posturing over the NIP, to realise some voters were THAT naive and manipulable really would be depressing.. Can't really understand how they're on 35% but I reckon that's their new high water mark and they'll never go over that again with Johnson as leader. Of course, it may mean nothing very much at all and is just our old friend margin of error at play. + or- 3% and all that. |
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2022 16:28:53 GMT
@isa I actually have a (sort of) MG myself, one of the last SAIC MG badged MG6's of which there are very few on the road (probably for good reason in a lot of cases). They were designed at and had final assembly at Longbridge though constructed initially in kit form in China and shipped from there. Later 'MG's are of completely Chinese manufacture. Touch wood it's been a great car which won awards for it's handling which is indeed very good for a car of it's size. Parts can be a bit hard to come by though. Ironically it went to the garage this morning as the electrics started playing up.. Well it's nice to see the famous octagon logo continues, even if some bearers of the badge are not quite as overtly sporting as others! Mind you, 'twas ever thus. MG were turning out 'sporty' versions of Morris and later BMC/BL saloons from the 1930s onwards. My father had an MG Magnette ZB when I was a nipper, a great handling and (for the time) very nippy sports saloon, still much admired in classic circles today. The good news about Isa is that parts are plentiful and cheap. Just as well, given their propensity to fail! |
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Post by shevii on May 16, 2022 16:35:02 GMT
Westminster Voting Intention (15 May): Labour 39% (–) Conservative 35% (+2) Liberal Democrat 12% (–) Green 6% (-1) Scottish National Party 4% (-1) Reform UK 3% (+1) Other 1% (–) Changes +/- 8 May redfieldandwiltonstrategies.com/latest-gb-voti… pic.twitter.com/llPkaIPfMh R&W are also now going to be doing polls on a Thursday as well after getting their 20k twitter followers. Should iron out a bit of any MOE or outliers although to be honest R&W are pretty stable anyway, which does make me a little bit suspicious as you'd expect some random variation from time to time. |
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domjg
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Post by domjg on May 16, 2022 16:37:15 GMT
@isa I actually have a (sort of) MG myself, one of the last SAIC MG badged MG6's of which there are very few on the road (probably for good reason in a lot of cases). They were designed at and had final assembly at Longbridge though constructed initially in kit form in China and shipped from there. Later 'MG's are of completely Chinese manufacture. Touch wood it's been a great car which won awards for it's handling which is indeed very good for a car of it's size. Parts can be a bit hard to come by though. Ironically it went to the garage this morning as the electrics started playing up.. Well it's nice to see the famous octagon logo continues, even if some bearers of the badge are not quite as overtly sporting as others! Mind you, 'twas ever thus. MG were turning out 'sporty' versions of Morris and later BMC/BL saloons from the 1930s onwards. My father had an MG Magnette ZB when I was a nipper, a great handling and (for the time) very nippy sports saloon, still much admired in classic circles today. The good news about Isa is that parts are plentiful and cheap. Just as well, given their propensity to fail! The booted (non hatchback) versions of the MG 6 were in fact badged as 'Magnette'. When I see car of such a vintage as yours, especially a British made one I'm always curious as to how you deal with corrosion. Is it not an ongoing battle to stop it disintegrating? Even relatively recent MX-5s were known for corrosion issues. |
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Post by guymonde on May 16, 2022 16:40:26 GMT
@isa
From a report in Motor Sport of the 1956 Monte Carlo Rally: "An especially well-equipped M.G. Magnette of Mr. Guymonde senior, later to be involved in a collision with a lorry, was a joy to see, being fitted with almost every conceivable type of gadget, such as a power assisted passenger seat, electric razor, wash-basin, cine camera, marine-type revolving headlamp-glass wipers, and other more normal pieces of paraphernalia, demonstrating some of the time that is taken by some of the non-works-entered vehicle owners to beat their opponents at their own game."
It also had a chemical toilet and a wash basin in the back seat -lovely - and a rear windscreen wiper that swept both inside and outside the glass. My dad was annoyed that he didn't think to patent it but I suppose patenting chemical toilets in the back seat might have been commercially marginal.
He spent many weeks in a hospital in Clermont Ferrand following his co-driver, Uncle Norman, smashing into a coal lorry whilst he was sleeping (dad, not Norman). One of my earliest memories is him coming home from the 1955 Rally (where he won a prize) in his not very boy racer Morris Oxford
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Post by robbiealive on May 16, 2022 16:46:14 GMT
Knowing nothing about a subject is hardly a disqualification for posting on here. Note the recent armchair generalship. I also visited Marcel Carnet's grave in Monmatre. He is buried next to his long-time partner. People leave metro tickets on the grave for a quirky reason. Abingdon suffers from being so close to Oxford, why stay there when you could be in Oxford in 15 mins. It's improved in recent times though. Nice pub on the river. Re Orwell, he lies not 30 mins walk from me (don't live in Sutton Courtenay though). I'm sure he'd be very proud to know that a new housing estate on the outskirts of that village is called 'Orwell Park'.. There's a nice pub, the Swan, next to the chuchyard if you ever feel the need to visit him and leave coins on his headstone as people do for some reason. DOMJG I shouldn't have been rude about yr town. I visited it in my 20s & early 30s when it seemd dull. Now I'm dull. Don't know why they leave coins. I think they leave metro tickets on Carnet;s tomb as they sell them in Carnets? |
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Post by steamdrivenandy on May 16, 2022 16:56:24 GMT
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2022 16:57:34 GMT
Well it's nice to see the famous octagon logo continues, even if some bearers of the badge are not quite as overtly sporting as others! Mind you, 'twas ever thus. MG were turning out 'sporty' versions of Morris and later BMC/BL saloons from the 1930s onwards. My father had an MG Magnette ZB when I was a nipper, a great handling and (for the time) very nippy sports saloon, still much admired in classic circles today. The good news about Isa is that parts are plentiful and cheap. Just as well, given their propensity to fail! The booted (non hatchback) versions of the MG 6 were in fact badged as 'Magnette'. When I see car of such a vintage as yours, especially a British made one I'm always curious as to how you deal with corrosion. Is it not an ongoing battle to stop it disintegrating? Even relatively recent MX-5s were known for corrosion issues. Yes, I thought I read that they had revived the Magnette name a few years back. Back in the day I had a 1967 Magnette myself. Not one for the purist, (it was essentially a very plush wood-and-leather trimmed Morris Oxford with twin carbs.), it went well but did not have the sporting pretensions of the ZB. Jane, as she was known, is actually still around, having been MOTed as recently as 2017 (no longer a legal requirement). Corrosion is a fact of life with old cars and sadly it is an ongoing battle to stop Isa from disintegrating! Despite being kept in a garage under a breathable cover and never being used in the rain or on wet roads, she is currently in intensive care having failed her MOT, including for some corrosion. A spot of welding at my nephew's garage and obligatory work on the brakes and she should soon be restored to health and ready to take on the Somerset lanes once again. I can't wait! |
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Post by lens on May 16, 2022 17:08:17 GMT
That's a total cognitive failure, to be honest. As many experts (yes, proper ones) have pointed out, it really does stand up to criticism. So "proper experts" are those who you agree with? Yet when an expert in even such as the BBC or the Guardian gives a view which disagrees with yours, they are then not a "proper expert"!? The irony is that is exactly the logic used by the anti-vax, anti-lockdown at all, brigade. Asthma + infectious respiratory infection = enhanced chance of death. So when covid comes along and people with asthma take brilliantly successful measures to protect themselves against infection, like mask wearing, social distancing, lockdowns, etc, they will also protect themselves against every other infection that could kill an asthma sufferer, and the fall in deaths here will be greater than elsewhere, because of our worse asthma rates. And therefore the excess deaths figure may not give an accurate picture of the comparative performance on covid containment. Surely even you must see the contradiction in what you are saying? One moment that there is this terrible pestilence come upon the planet which will doom us all - and the very next that it's only killed people who would have died anyway? Surely (on an average basis anyway) that's exactly what "excess death figures" mean? Or are you advocating that for the foreseeable future everyone should be forced to endure lockdown, distancing (so pubs and restaurants closed or reduced capacity?) compulsory mask wearing everywhere etc etc to try to help with the asthma situation? Best of luck getting elected with that platform! The last available data on the covid dashboard has Deaths within 28 days of positive test of 1389, so that's 1389 deaths with a brand new pathogen never before known to exist, yet the excess deaths are meant to be below normal. I'm afraid it doesn't take a genius level of IQ to work out that if 1389 people have died from a new disease yet deaths are lower than normal, something is skewing the figures. Sheesh!! And you accuse others of "cognitive failure"! As has been pointed out many times, "deaths within 28 days of a positive test" does *NOT* (necessarily) mean it was Covid that killed the person. In an extreme case it could apply to someone who had Covid, was fully recovered, and was killed in a car accident. This error was pointed out to you earlier when you quoted figures of under 5's being admitted to hospital and assumed the admissions were due to Covid. You were wrong. The figure is of children admitted to hospital for any reason who went on to give a positive test - even if asymptomatic and with the Covid nothing to do with their being in hospital. Why do you fail to understand the difference between "with" Covid, and "because of" Covid? I will continue to flag up where you are all going wrong, by looking at the science, the numbers, and and data. And so far on covid, the people I cite have been right at every turn, and people like you have been consistently wrong. Alec, you were demonstrably wrong about the under 5's numbers, and if you were really being objective you'd realise you were wrong about a lot of things. Consistently throughout the pandemic, forecasts have been made time after time which have turned out to be wildly pessimistic. When "free" testing ended there were many voices predicting what a mistake it was and how it would lead to a big upturn in cases - it didn't happen. Same with when so many other restrictions were ended. As the Guardian article makes clear, once a high vaccination level had been reached, level of lockdown didn't make much difference to overall case rates. (In Scotland, all it seems to have done is delay cases, such that their problem is currently worse than England.) If you consider it an "extreme misreading of science", then please explain the raw data it's based on? Why is the rate in England not worse than in all the other UK nations, in spite of the absence of tighter restrictions? I'll leave with the quote from the Guardian:
"Last autumn, many were calling for England to follow the example of Germany (and other European countries) in bringing back mask mandates, vaccine passports and other restrictions, as they had lower case rates at the time. But as I and many others pointed out, once vaccination programmes were complete, these strategies were likely to be simply postponing infections to the winter, when health systems would have been less able to cope – which is indeed what happened." |
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2022 17:11:22 GMT
@isa From a report in Motor Sport of the 1956 Monte Carlo Rally: "An especially well-equipped M.G. Magnette of Mr. Guymonde senior, later to be involved in a collision with a lorry, was a joy to see, being fitted with almost every conceivable type of gadget, such as a power assisted passenger seat, electric razor, wash-basin, cine camera, marine-type revolving headlamp-glass wipers, and other more normal pieces of paraphernalia, demonstrating some of the time that is taken by some of the non-works-entered vehicle owners to beat their opponents at their own game." It also had a chemical toilet and a wash basin in the back seat -lovely - and a rear windscreen wiper that swept both inside and outside the glass. My dad was annoyed that he didn't think to patent it but I suppose patenting chemical toilets in the back seat might have been commercially marginal. He spent many weeks in a hospital in Clermont Ferrand following his co-driver, Uncle Norman, smashing into a coal lorry whilst he was sleeping (dad, not Norman). One of my earliest memories is him coming home from the 1955 Rally (where he won a prize) in his not very boy racer Morris Oxford Wow, guymonde, that's absolutely brilliant! An amazing article and story. Thanks for sharing. |
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domjg
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Post by domjg on May 16, 2022 17:16:55 GMT
Abingdon suffers from being so close to Oxford, why stay there when you could be in Oxford in 15 mins. It's improved in recent times though. Nice pub on the river. Re Orwell, he lies not 30 mins walk from me (don't live in Sutton Courtenay though). I'm sure he'd be very proud to know that a new housing estate on the outskirts of that village is called 'Orwell Park'.. There's a nice pub, the Swan, next to the chuchyard if you ever feel the need to visit him and leave coins on his headstone as people do for some reason. DOMJG I shouldn't have been rude about yr town. I visited it in my 20s & early 30s when it seemd dull. Now I'm dull. Don't know why they leave coins. I think they leave metro tickets on Carnet;s tomb as they sell them in Carnets? 'salright, it's not really my town just the nearest one to the village we moved to last year.My heart's still in Oxford town where we were before. |
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