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Post by laszlo4new on Nov 9, 2024 20:29:13 GMT
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 9, 2024 20:29:57 GMT
eorI believe the Republicans lost all the down ticket in North Carolina, which is good news for the residents.
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Post by turk on Nov 9, 2024 20:38:42 GMT
Colin
Storm shadow is a joint British/ French weapon at 2 million a pop . I suspect it’s got more to do with the poor state of both countries economies than anything else.
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Post by mercian on Nov 9, 2024 20:41:40 GMT
I think my word of an 'alecandanny' to represent an endless debate that never gets anywhere and potentially goes on for years, is in danger of being superseded by 'carfrewandlens'. Or perhaps alecandanny is confined to medical matters and carfrewandlens to more technical stuff?
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Post by colin on Nov 9, 2024 20:47:37 GMT
Colin Storm shadow is a joint British/ French weapon at 2 million a pop . I suspect it’s got more to do with the poor state of both countries economies than anything else. Starmer announced £2.5 bn for Ukraine this year I think. There is some foot dragging on Storm Shadow -I dont get it. This is Starmer commenting a couple of months ago :- " Idon’t think the victory plan will be about a sole issue like long-range missiles. It will be about a strategic, overarching route for Ukraine to find a way through this and succeed against Russian aggression.” What is that supposed to mean ?. If they say they need it wtf does he know ? |
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c-a-r-f-r-e-w
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A step on the way toward the demise of the liberal elite? Or just a blip…
Posts: 6,721
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Nov 9, 2024 20:48:56 GMT
I think my word of an 'alecandanny' to represent an endless debate that never gets anywhere and potentially goes on for years, is in danger of being superseded by 'carfrewandlens'. Or perhaps alecandanny is confined to medical matters and carfrewandlens to more technical stuff? It is getting somewhere. For example, lens now knows you can pipe hydrogen ashore. Anyway he said he’d had his last word. |
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Post by jib on Nov 9, 2024 21:01:47 GMT
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Post by turk on Nov 9, 2024 21:57:30 GMT
Colin
Having looked further into STORM SHADOW in France /SCALP EG your right I don’t think it’s the money a couple of factors seem to be in play.
Being a relatively old weapon developed in 1994-2001 which went into U.K. service in 2003. It looks like the U.K. has already donated most of its stocks to the Ukraine.
Also as the MOD and France have been since 2016 developing a new long range missile to replace Storm Shadow ,and as a result Storm Shadow has been scaled back in the U.K. & France although it’s due to stay in service until 2032.
So it looks like it’s just that we don’t have anymore to give of course the US could supply long range missile but Biden put an embargo on that and even if he wanted Trump can’t supply anything until he becomes President on 20th Jan 2025.
The French did produce a export model with a reduced range which they exported to the Arab Emirates called Black Shaheen but I think they completed that order.
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Post by eor on Nov 9, 2024 22:24:51 GMT
I think my word of an 'alecandanny' to represent an endless debate that never gets anywhere and potentially goes on for years, is in danger of being superseded by 'carfrewandlens'. Or perhaps alecandanny is confined to medical matters and carfrewandlens to more technical stuff? Not sure if an alecandanny sounds more like a dilemma or a regional name for a vegetable dish. Either way a bit harsh on lens! And we should cut c-a-r-f-r-e-w some slack too, it's not every week your club sacks the most successful manager they've had in decades and dabbles with appointing Frank Lampard instead. |
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Post by leftieliberal on Nov 9, 2024 22:26:25 GMT
I spent hours trying to persuade US voters to choose Harris not Trump. I know why she lostThere were other reasons, but the quote below is surely significant But gender did play a role. Time and again, voters, very often women themselves, told me that they just didn’t think that “America is ready for a female president”. People said they couldn’t “see her in the chair” and asked if I “really thought a woman could run the country”. One person memorably told me that she couldn’t vote for Harris because “you don’t see women building skyscrapers”. Sometimes, these people would be persuaded, but more often than not it was a red line. Many conversations would start with positive discussions on policy and then end on Harris and her gender. That is an extraordinary and uncomfortable truth.
Unlike the UK where acceptance of women leaders was fairly uncontroversial, for American women (and I suspect Oliver Hall is talking mainly about white American women) there still seems to be a 'glass ceiling' for American women leaders.
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Post by lens on Nov 9, 2024 23:21:14 GMT
Oh really! If we have now moved on to talking about offshore wind, then yes - of course, the cost of cabling to connect has to be factored in. So what is your alternative? Offshore hydrogen and/or ammonia production with no cable connection to shore? Leaving aside the capital plant cost for electrolysis, compression etc, then wind turbines (and cables) largely operate unattended except for occasional maintenance. That simply will not be the case for what you seem to be proposing. Such would need to be permanently manned - offshore. And when you've made the hydrogen/ammonia and stored it, what then? Are you proposing the hydrogen/ammonia will just "float to shore over the waves!" ?? Have you even started to consider the implications (cost, safety and environmental) of any such approach? And you think I'm the one " incapable of considering the cost of your own arguments"!! A pot calling the kettle black? Crikey lens, that’s a lot more to write to miss that they simply propose to pipe the hydrogen etc. ashore. Through a pipe. You seem determined to contest almost anything. Is this your last word now or are you going to have to come to terms with the radical concept of a pipe. (Or maybe you think they don’t realise they might have to pay for a pipe or something). They "simply" propose to pipe the hydrogen ashore!!?? Through a pipe? Seriously? Technically possible, obviously...... but viable? And all this because your original concern was over the cost of an electrical connection from offshore!? So you are now suggesting that to save the cost of an electrical connection, then instead they should spend a small fortune on plant offshore, with conversion inefficiencies and vastly higher operation and maintenance costs, AND now an underwater pipeline!! How do you think the cost of a pipeline alone compares with an equivalent power cable? Please tell me you are joking? That I was right before with a suspicion of trolling? |
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Post by mercian on Nov 10, 2024 0:17:41 GMT
I think my word of an 'alecandanny' to represent an endless debate that never gets anywhere and potentially goes on for years, is in danger of being superseded by 'carfrewandlens'. Or perhaps alecandanny is confined to medical matters and carfrewandlens to more technical stuff? It is getting somewhere. For example, lens now knows you can pipe hydrogen ashore. Anyway he said he’d had his last word. You were wrong.  |
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Post by mercian on Nov 10, 2024 1:31:22 GMT
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c-a-r-f-r-e-w
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Nov 10, 2024 5:30:52 GMT
Crikey lens, that’s a lot more to write to miss that they simply propose to pipe the hydrogen etc. ashore. Through a pipe. You seem determined to contest almost anything. Is this your last word now or are you going to have to come to terms with the radical concept of a pipe. (Or maybe you think they don’t realise they might have to pay for a pipe or something). They "simply" propose to pipe the hydrogen ashore!!?? Through a pipe? Seriously? Technically possible, obviously...... but viable? And all this because your original concern was over the cost of an electrical connection from offshore!? So you are now suggesting that to save the cost of an electrical connection, then instead they should spend a small fortune on plant offshore, with conversion inefficiencies and vastly higher operation and maintenance costs, AND now an underwater pipeline!! How do you think the cost of a pipeline alone compares with an equivalent power cable? Please tell me you are joking? That I was right before with a suspicion of trolling? Seems a bit much to accuse of trolling when you are still going on about it after saying you’d stop. And these are not my proposals, I tend to be more interested in other ideas, I am just acknowledging your issues by making you aware both of what others in the industry propose, and also that pipes are a thing. (Similarly when you suggest using the grid, it isn’t your idea is it. Am sincerely hoping it isn’t your idea…🤞) Yes, they are proposing building offshore, which might seem a radical proposal to you, but surprisingly they have been building stuff offshore like drilling platforms - even housing working communities - and piping gas ashore for years. Shocking as it may seem, they haven’t been listening to you lens about the onerous costs of building offshore, and are already building wind turbines offshore! (Since you appear to have some deep-seated need to question everything, I have attached a pic in case you don’t believe me). So it depends on the profitability but adding some electrolysers might not be quite the moonshot you might think… 🚀 Attachments:
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c-a-r-f-r-e-w
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Nov 10, 2024 5:38:07 GMT
lens And then if you don’t just consider one side of the costs, but compare to the expense of the grid alternative: leccy cables, batteries, building out the grid - pylons, substations, planning permissions, waiting a decade currently in a queue to be able attach to the grid - costs which remarkably don’t seem to feature much in your deliberations… (For the avoidance of doubt, have attached a pic of some pylons and a substation) So in the end it will come down to relative costs, availability of things like batteries or electrolysers or grid links etc., price of hydrogen etc. etc., but in terms of problems, fusion is more of an interesting challenge… Attachments:
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 10, 2024 8:03:11 GMT
I think the worst element of the rise of fascism in the U.S. and isolationist nationalism in the UK and Europe is the loss of optimism
Traditionally the attraction of the U.S. was the opportunity for all to succeed.
The purpose of the European union was to provide the opportunity for peaceful and easy movement of people and goods within its member countries,to allow people to live, work and form relationships anywhere they wanted with whomever they wanted free of national borders.
The rise of trump fascism in the U.S. and the brexitanians in the UK put paid to this for our two countries, at least for now.
Under their philosophy no one can win unless someone else loses. Success means not so much actually achieving anything positive but primarily the joy of seeing the previous internationalist and inclusive attitudes undermined.
It's why both brexitanians and trump fascists revel in the " tears" of their opponents.You don't need to gain anything provided someone else has lost.
It's a dark nihilistic view and our countries are both diminished by it.
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Post by colin on Nov 10, 2024 8:09:31 GMT
The Demographics of Trump's win www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0mzl7zygpmI was struck by two phrases:- "Older, white conservatives were dying off," and "“Demography,” these left-wing optimists liked to say, “is destiny.” Where have I heard that before ?  |
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c-a-r-f-r-e-w
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A step on the way toward the demise of the liberal elite? Or just a blip…
Posts: 6,721
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Nov 10, 2024 8:16:45 GMT
The Demographics of Trump's win www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0mzl7zygpmI was struck by two phrases:- "Older, white conservatives were dying off," and "“Demography,” these left-wing optimists liked to say, “is destiny.” Where have I heard that before ? morning Col., I think the link might be slightly off, I’m assuming this is the page? www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0mzl7zygpmothere is a handy graphic on the page which I have attached Attachments:
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 10, 2024 8:25:46 GMT
A glimmer of hope in the U.S. comes from an unexpected source.
Mitch McConnell.
McConnell the current republican minority leader in the Senate, he's standing down as leader at the end of this year.
The trumpian fascists want Trump maga sycophant Rick Scott to replace him.
However McConnell in what Nazi lunatic Tucker Carlson is describing as a " coup" is trying to avoid this outcome.
At least three Republicans are vying for the top spot — John Cornyn of Texas, Rick Scott of Florida, and John Thune of South Dakota who serves as the Senate minority whip — NBC News reported, and Carlson took issue with two of them.
“What the hell is going on in the US Senate?” Carlson posted on X on Saturday afternoon. After Trump won, “Mitch McConnell engineers a coup against his agenda by calling early leadership elections in the Senate by secret ballot. Two of the three candidates hate Trump and what he ran on.”
While of course none of these senators had the guts to vote to impeach Trump Cornyn and Thune can at least count and recognise the catastrophic damage trumps tariff plans would have on the U.S. economy.
If either of the vaguely sane candidates gets to be speaker it should reduce Trump's capacity to act.
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c-a-r-f-r-e-w
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Nov 10, 2024 8:38:26 GMT
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Post by wb61 on Nov 10, 2024 8:59:23 GMT
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 10, 2024 9:07:41 GMT
c-a-r-f-r-e-wCurrent trend has the democrats up in 11 of the remaining races they are within 1% in three others and less than 3% behind in three more. So it's possible to get to 219. 4 look likely republican holds. The democrats are likely to end up three to five short but not a done deal.
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Post by jib on Nov 10, 2024 9:09:26 GMT
Turned out to be a complete landslide for Trump.
"Donald Trump has won the presidential election in Arizona, the Associated Press declared on Saturday, completing a clean sweep of all seven battleground states and locking in a decisive electoral college victory over the Democratic vice-president, Kamala Harris." (Guardian).
The Democrat mandated legal issues will disappear now. Can't help thinking that it would have been better if they had never appeared. Always felt like a witch hunt based on trumped up charges that just fed the monster.
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 10, 2024 10:59:12 GMT
The rapist lunatic president elect currently leads by 2.6% from Harris or in brexitanian cobbler speak " a complete landslide ".
He has secured the majority of the popular vote for the first time for a republican since G W Bush second term and the electoral college hands him disproportionate vote. In the house where the result tends to be far more proportionate the very tight race is far more reflective of the electorate
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Post by mark61 on Nov 10, 2024 11:00:11 GMT
I recall when I was a young Lefty activist in the 80's and 90's the beginning of this trend, noticeable in Labour local authorities particularly in London where Man Hole Covers were renamed Person Hole covers and the like or Tower Blocks were renamed after anti apartheid martyrs (some of this was no doubt apocryphal). I had a friend on a Social History Community Programme in Coventry (remember that?) the remit was to go out to Schools and Care Homes to give talks on Local History. They spent the first six months of the 12 month programme arguing about the format of the publicity leaflet, the burning issue was the border of the leaflet was made up of photos of 'typical' local people and the gender and Racial balance of the photos was the subject of much heated debate. My friend claimed that on the final agreed leaflet out of 10 pictures only one was a white male, but I think he said that to jazz up the Story a bit! I'm not sure any talks were delivered before the programme expired. At the time I saw this as tokenism, as a retreat from the real Political fight when our side were getting hammered, When you are in out of Government for a long period of time there is not much you can do that has a real impact on Social and Political Injustice, the Left began the process of talking more to itself, It was difficult doing the stuff that Crossbat and JimJam do talking to Working Class voters when the tide is running against you. It was more comfortable for the Left to begin talking amongst themselves. Culture and identity Politics moved up the agenda, redistribution Social justice was a bit old hat. Culture and Identity Politics whilst important, have the attraction for the Left that it looks like you are fighting the good Fight and they don't cost much to implement, don't require tax and Spend, but they don't really pose much threat to the Status Quo, Cameron's Govt for instance was happily Socially Liberal. The danger here as The article wb61 references that this becomes a new form of Credentialism where part of the middle and Professional classes hoard virtue and use it to elbow others aside a struggle within the elite masquerading as a struggle against the elite on behalf of the poor and dispossessed. More worrying still it provides fertile ground for the Right to claim this Cultural Elite are in fact the real Elite thus obscuring where the real power lies. |
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Post by moby on Nov 10, 2024 11:22:09 GMT
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Post by jib on Nov 10, 2024 11:24:42 GMT
The rapist lunatic president elect currently leads by 2.6% from Harris or in brexitanian cobbler speak " a complete landslide ". He has secured the majority of the popular vote for the first time for a republican since G W Bush second term and the electoral college hands him disproportionate vote. In the house where the result tends to be far more proportionate the very tight race is far more reflective of the electorate That's democracy. It's something that obviously causes you conceptual hardship and extreme wishful thinking. Such a shame jen can't also share "her" thoughts with us anymore. |
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Post by shevii on Nov 10, 2024 11:36:46 GMT
I recall when I was a young Lefty activist in the 80's and 90's the beginning of this trend, noticeable in Labour local authorities particularly in London where Man Hole Covers were renamed Person Hole covers and the like or Tower Blocks were renamed after anti apartheid martyrs (some of this was no doubt apocryphal). I had a friend on a Social History Community Programme in Coventry (remember that?) the remit was to go out to Schools and Care Homes to give talks on Local History. They spent the first six months of the 12 month programme arguing about the format of the publicity leaflet, the burning issue was the border of the leaflet was made up of photos of 'typical' local people and the gender and Racial balance of the photos was the subject of much heated debate. My friend claimed that on the final agreed leaflet out of 10 pictures only one was a white male, but I think he said that to jazz up the Story a bit! I'm not sure any talks were delivered before the programme expired. At the time I saw this as tokenism, as a retreat from the real Political fight when our side were getting hammered, When you are in out of Government for a long period of time there is not much you can do that has a real impact on Social and Political Injustice, the Left began the process of talking more to itself, It was difficult doing the stuff that Crossbat and JimJam do talking to Working Class voters when the tide is running against you. It was more comfortable for the Left to begin talking amongst themselves. Culture and identity Politics moved up the agenda, redistribution Social justice was a bit old hat. Culture and Identity Politics whilst important, have the attraction for the Left that it looks like you are fighting the good Fight and they don't cost much to implement, don't require tax and Spend, but they don't really pose much threat to the Status Quo, Cameron's Govt for instance was happily Socially Liberal. The danger here as The article wb61 references that this becomes a new form of Credentialism where part of the middle and Professional classes hoard virtue and use it to elbow others aside a struggle within the elite masquerading as a struggle against the elite on behalf of the poor and dispossessed. More worrying still it provides fertile ground for the Right to claim this Cultural Elite are in fact the real Elite thus obscuring where the real power lies. While I don't disagree with the points you make, the article did not even mention "the left"- it was about wealthy "liberals". The Democratic party has never been "the left" and while Labour in the 1980's did have an element of renaming things Nelson Mandela Hall or whatever, most of what they were campaigning on were bread and butter issues. It was just they were campaigning on public services at a time when Thatcher had an economic advantage with North Sea Oil and a benign global economy compared to the 1970's. She had enough of a popularity and economic outcome from those things as well as selling the family silver to win over enough voters to keep her in power. You can't necessarily pigeonhole people but the defining strand of liberalism is socially liberal/fiscally conservative. Obviously there are crossovers but the defining strand of the left is to help the poorest in society. In the 1980's this included combating racism and anti Apartheid as well as anti gay sentiments but it was mostly about economic issues such as the miner's strike, unemployment and the damage being done to public services and communities. Currently "the left" (which certainly does not include the current Labour Party) are doing similar and campaigning on public services and poverty with additional issues such as the genocide in Palestine, global warming and trans rights. That article as best I could see was a critique of wealthy liberals who simply want to pretend to be good people while protecting their wealth and the neoliberal system that goes with it. I don't think it was criticising Black Lives Matter or Me Too movements, simply that many in those movements were not moving beyond the symptoms and onto the causes. |
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Nov 10, 2024 11:44:17 GMT
In reference to Trump and his possible Ukraine plan, interesting to see Russian casualty figures and the drain on Russia's economy reported today It would be a terrible decision to back away from supporting Ukraine at this point and give Putin a win www.bbc.com/news/articles/cp3nv7j1xkxo'Russia has suffered its worst ever month for casualties since the start of the war in Ukraine, the UK chief of defence staff has told the BBC. Admiral Sir Tony Radakin said Russia’s forces suffered an average of about 1,500 dead and injured "every single day" in October, bringing its losses to 700,000 since the war began in February 2022... Russia is spending more than 40% of its public expenditure on defence and security, which he said was "an enormous drain" on the country. While allies of US President-elect Donald Trump insist that Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky may have to cede territory to bring the conflict to an end, Sir Tony insisted that Western allies would be resolute for "as long as it takes". "That’s the message President Putin has to absorb and the reassurance for President Zelensky," he told the programme |
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Nov 10, 2024 11:47:04 GMT
Don't think Zelenskiy will have any problems with that - he's much more concerned about the security guarantees that will follow the peace settlement. You could be right-though he will have no choice. I couldnt agree more with you that the status of a post conflict Ukraine is the key issue. And what Putin's red lines are for it. If he demands -lets say- removal of all foreign supplied weapons , neutrality & no membership of NATO -what then ? Putin knows that he can have a good shot at subverting the next election . Zelensky must surely know that if he doesn't get democratic & territorial integrity guaranteed by military intervention , its all over. I just cant see Trump's USA or the EU signing up to that. There is absolutely no reason for Russia to concede anything whatsoever if they believes the US is simply going to withdraw, as it always does when it supports countries. Putin will get two big victories, the whole of Ukraine annexed as part of Russian inviolable motherland. The whole world learning the lesson the US is an utterly unreliable ally. You have to ask, had Russia invaded Poland, or maybe attacked the UK, would the US be willing to fight a three year stalemate war against Russia and then continue indefinitely? The answer quite obviously is no. But more than that, with Ukraine occupied in maybe a years time, Putin still has this experiencd army ready to go. He isnt going to just send them all home, he will use them. |
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