steve
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Post by steve on Dec 6, 2023 18:25:53 GMT
Former speaker of the house Kevin McCarthy announces his resignation from the house at the end of the year, another GOP congressman goes in March if both seats fall to the democrats so does their majority.
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Dec 6, 2023 18:28:48 GMT
On a quick reading of the Bill it is an attempt to remove the power of the European Convention on Human Rights and enforcement by the ECHR without actually withdrawing from the convention. Can't see the House of Lords going for that. Lord Sumption made that point, that its legitimate to withdraw from the ECHR, it isnt legitimate to not withdraw but ignore it. If everyone did that, why the treaty with Rwanda wouldnt be worth the paper it is written on! All very reminiscent of Neville Chamberlain returning to the UK waving his treaty with one A Hitler promising not to misbehave. And like Chamberlain, the whole purpose arguably is simply to delay matters.
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Post by alec on Dec 6, 2023 18:30:44 GMT
isa - not sure Sunak's fall will be that unpredictable. He doesn't have so far to fall, after all, does he?
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Post by alec on Dec 6, 2023 18:34:06 GMT
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Post by peterbell on Dec 6, 2023 18:34:44 GMT
Reports Jenrick has resigned, not confirmed yet Jenrick not present in the HoC as Cleverly makes his speech. Tends to confirm the rumours re Jenricks resignation. Cooper aasked Cleverly whether he had resigned but Cleverly did not answer as usual.
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Dec 6, 2023 18:36:09 GMT
Sumption was contemptuous of the idea that the government would try to legislate a fact, but that seems to be what they intend to try to do. He also said that a new treaty with Rwanda wouldn't help because Rwanda wasn't institutionally strong enough to be regarded as trustworthy when it came to promises about what would and would not happen to asylum seekers sent there for processing. Both also argued that provisions for the safety of asylum seekers were written into several laws and included in international treaties that we've ratified (I forget the exact details), such that leaving the ECHR would not be sufficient to rid us of our obligations. The bottom line is that the crown in parliament, or whatever the phrase, has absolute sovereignty in the Uk and can indeed legislate that black is now white. The real question is what are the implicatins of abrogating all these international treaties. However the timing is such that no such consequences are likely before the next election. I can't really see the HCR rushing to throw britain out of the treaty for non compliance before the anticipated election and change of government. I can see con absolutely delight in having this as a live election issue. Will lab reverse the deal and bring all those nasty refugees back to britain now con have got rid of them? Expect the election to coincide with the crunch point for this legal battle.
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steve
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Post by steve on Dec 6, 2023 18:37:20 GMT
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Dec 6, 2023 18:39:13 GMT
This isn't a partisan point. Labour has been complicit in it's share of epic delays to justice. Over the exact same issues too.
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Dec 6, 2023 18:43:33 GMT
"Mr Shapps rejected calls for Western allies to quietly persuade Ukraine’s President Zelenskyy to consider a peace agreement with Russia.
"It can only be for Ukraine to decide how and at what point they want to talk about those kinds of things," he said."That's not a decision that others can make for them. So we will stand with Ukraine for as long as they need to continue fighting this war." www.itv.com/news/2023-12-05/grant-shapps-the-world-cannot-give-up-and-get-bored-of-ukraine-war
However the british government has not proposed a solution to the huge funding deficit of UK armed forces, with obvious impact on supplying arms to Ukraine which we do not possess. Another problem for the next government to solve.
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Dec 6, 2023 18:44:01 GMT
Made me laugh 😃
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Post by hireton on Dec 6, 2023 18:44:20 GMT
This is just too good. Rwanda government as the defender of international law and the EHRC:
And:
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Post by peterbell on Dec 6, 2023 18:47:19 GMT
Sam Coates saying that friends of Jenrick say he will resign this evening
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Dec 6, 2023 18:47:27 GMT
When Rwanda lectures us on the importance of keeping to International law you realise how far we have fallen Did Rwanda take the money for preparing to receive refugees secure in the knowledge that if the UK abides by international law, none will ever arrive in Rwanda? That would be rather funny! Outfoxed by a tinpot dictatorship!
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Post by hireton on Dec 6, 2023 18:48:05 GMT
And:
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Danny
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Post by Danny on Dec 6, 2023 18:49:55 GMT
isa - not sure Sunak's fall will be that unpredictable. He doesn't have so far to fall, after all, does he? You mean of course being very rich he will continue a lavish lifestyle?
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Dec 6, 2023 18:59:16 GMT
Jenrick has gone
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Dec 6, 2023 19:06:23 GMT
Hard to think it was only 4 years and 3 Prime Minister's ago Wonder how long before the new tory saviour will be acclaimed
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Post by hireton on Dec 6, 2023 19:07:45 GMT
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command."
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Post by hireton on Dec 6, 2023 19:10:30 GMT
Steve Peers on the Rwanda bill:
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Post by peterbell on Dec 6, 2023 19:10:59 GMT
Cleverly announces in HoC that Jenrick has resigned
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Post by mark61 on Dec 6, 2023 19:31:14 GMT
I watched the the former Prime minister answer questions at the Covid inquiry today, his performance was pretty much as I expected, a combination of not very convincing contrition, some bluster and a very poor grasp of detail which was surprising given the rump of his support have reported he has been preparing for this day for a year! It struck me that he really can't be anything other than who he is, a man who with the benefit of a privileged background has blagged his way through life, always failing upwards, unprepared to, in fact congenitally unable to put in the hard yards to actually be good at anything he does.
What has stuck me most from what I have heard so far, is not only the scale of unpreparedness, but the absolute dysfunction at the heart of Government during the first few months of the pandemic and then the subsequent complacency as it worked it's way through the UK over the next 2 years. A Government performance which for us sadly mirrors the Personality of the Prime Minister himself. This outcome was no surprise to many of us, who find it hard to understand how so many of our fellow citizens thought he was Prime Minister material.
Having watched Hugo Keith KC examine Mr Johnson today, a Question for Political Journalists and correspondents in Print and TV media why or how did you fail to hold him to account for so long? You must surely have had access to information which was not readily in the Public domain about the shambles at the heart of Government.
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Post by wb61 on Dec 6, 2023 19:31:36 GMT
If the bill in that form is insufficient for the likes of Jenrick and Braverman I feel terrified of the type of country they would like to turn us into.
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Post by EmCat on Dec 6, 2023 19:34:25 GMT
"The Patriot" in particular. Mad Max was very unrealistic, it was supposed to be in a post apocalyptic future and there weren't even any Zombies 😀 Not all post apocalyptic futures have zombies - that's the "Zombie Apocalypse" Besides, Mad Max was only at the "societal collapse" stage. Mad Max 2 was the post Apocalyptic one.
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Dec 6, 2023 19:37:42 GMT
She's not the only one, it's like arguing black is white, but at the same time white is black
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Dec 6, 2023 19:54:36 GMT
Precise and concise summation of the Rwanda Bill
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pjw1961
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Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state, an intolerable one.
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Post by pjw1961 on Dec 6, 2023 20:02:53 GMT
It is truly remarkable to watch a government rip itself apart over what has only ever been a chimera, a fantasy policy designed to generate favorable coverage in the Tory press rather than do anything real. Weird.
The Tory psycho-drama rolls on toward its glorious 14th year and the rest of us just have to watch.
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Post by isa on Dec 6, 2023 20:12:16 GMT
Sam Coates on Sky News just now - "Is this salvageable for Sunak"? He thinks the regime could be on the verge of "dramatic" events.
Has the tipping point been reached?
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Post by alec on Dec 6, 2023 20:18:25 GMT
It's beginning to look a lot like Christmas.....
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Post by alec on Dec 6, 2023 20:22:14 GMT
Oh oh -
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Post by crossbat11 on Dec 6, 2023 20:32:25 GMT
Cleverly's full statement to the Commons informing members of Jenrick's resignation. It was vaguely poetic: -
"Madam Deputy Speaker, the Cabinet are not yet all come back, but I have spoke With one that saw him resign who did report That very frankly the Minister for Immigration confessed his disappointments Implored the Prime Minister's acceptance and set forth A deep sorrow at going. Quite frankly, nothing in his ministerial career Became him like the leaving it; he resigned As one that had been studied in his resignation To throw away the dearest thing he owed,
As 'twere a careless trifle."
Yvette Cooper responded, rather disingenuously, but no less poetically, "Alas poor Robert, I knew him Madam Deputy Speaker."
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