domjg
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Post by domjg on Nov 29, 2024 14:21:56 GMT
You have to wonder if Musk is deliberately or at least uncaringly driving some of his businesses into the ground: www.theguardian.com/technology/2024/nov/29/tesla-owners-elon-musk Very anecdotally in liberal EV driver heavy Oxfordshire I've seen vanishingly few new registration Teslas in the last few months. Not that long ago they seemed to be everywhere. |
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Nov 29, 2024 14:23:50 GMT
Listening to large parts of the assisted dying debate I think it is Parliament at it's best
MPs on both sides of the debate and not on party lines making coherent and thoughtful points. Glad it was a private members bill to avoid the risk of tribalism on such an important subject
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colin
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Post by colin on Nov 29, 2024 14:27:02 GMT
Not a favourite of mine, but if the BBC report is to be believed this is not a resigning offence. Mugged as a young woman & mistaken about a stolen phone ? ! www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cdxy1kp73y9oWhy did Starmer not refuse her resignation and support her ? Maybe he asked her to go ? I think it may be a little more complicated than that. She may have been mugged, but there is a question mark over whether she then knowingly exaggerated what had gone missing? Can't say I've paid it a lot of attention, but I think it partly revolves around a phone she claimed was part of the theft she later claimed she had left at home. The problem for her (I believe) was that it came to light when the phone was switched on, and the police tracked it, them eventually coming to her house. If it was a genuine mistake, and she subsequently came across it and then reported it hadn't been stolen, I doubt anything more would have happened. On her guilt haven't we got to defer to the judgement of the Court which considered the case ? There may be other reasons to do with HoC procedure & declaration which are pertinent to her resignation. |
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 29, 2024 14:29:26 GMT
Maga Mike in danger of losing effectively the house majority now sitting at 215:217 until at least April Special elections. they have zero chance of 100% unity.
What a tragedy the mags loons will be unable to police the capital to keep the one trans congresswoman out of MTG's toilets.
All the seats currently vacant should be safe republican holds but who knows if the chaos anticipated when the lunatic takes office transpires.
There are also a couple of what passes for moderate republicans notably Brian Fitzpatrick a former FBI special agent , who will be less than impressed with the lunatics teams efforts to politicize and defund federal agencies.
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Post by pete on Nov 29, 2024 14:31:36 GMT
Assisted dying. I'm against. The state helping people to die. Its opening a pandoras box.
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Nov 29, 2024 14:36:15 GMT
You have to wonder if Musk is deliberately or at least uncaringly driving some of his businesses into the ground: www.theguardian.com/technology/2024/nov/29/tesla-owners-elon-musk Very anecdotally in liberal EV driver heavy Oxfordshire I've seen vanishingly few new registration Teslas in the last few months. Not that long ago they seemed to be everywhere. It might not be anecdotal - I posted the Telegraph graphic the other day showing how EV sales were falling behind expectations. How much it’s to do unrealistic expectations, with Musk, or with prices not falling enough, not enough chargers or indeed other things, I’m not sure about Attachments:
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Post by lens on Nov 29, 2024 14:41:02 GMT
I think it may be a little more complicated than that. She may have been mugged, but there is a question mark over whether she then knowingly exaggerated what had gone missing? Can't say I've paid it a lot of attention, but I think it partly revolves around a phone she claimed was part of the theft she later claimed she had left at home. The problem for her (I believe) was that it came to light when the phone was switched on, and the police tracked it, them eventually coming to her house. If it was a genuine mistake, and she subsequently came across it and then reported it hadn't been stolen, I doubt anything more would have happened. On her guilt haven't we got to defer to the judgement of the Court which considered the case ? There may be other reasons to do with HoC procedure & declaration which are pertinent to her resignation. Worth reading some of the detail behind it - www.theguardian.com/politics/2024/nov/29/louise-haigh-labour-outspoken-young-survivor-is-derailed-by-her-past. Hardly the crime of the century, but apparently there is indeed a lot more to it than just a lady being mistaken what had gone missing after a mugging. (Like, other work phones that went missing and were the subject of an investigation, and delaying for several months going to a police interview when requested.) It also seems to be the case she was less than honest about what she told no 10 in the past - quote from the Guardian:
"As reports first broke about the conviction, the transport secretary issued a statement which included the claim that she had told Starmer about the incident as soon as he appointed her to his shadow cabinet.
When Downing Street refused to confirm that had happened, it seemed inevitable she would have to resign." |
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Nov 29, 2024 14:45:16 GMT
Assisted dying Bill passed the second reading
MPs supported the bill by 330 to 275, a majority of 55.
Bigger majority than I thought it would be, the hard work of the Committee stage starts now
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 29, 2024 14:51:36 GMT
"On her guilt haven't we got to defer to the judgement of the Court which considered the case ?"
It wasn't the courts judgement Haigh pleaded guilty on the advice of her solicitor.
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Post by turk on Nov 29, 2024 14:51:38 GMT
Steve
I seem to remember you calling Johnson a convicted criminal because he got £50 quid fine for eating a piece of cake. I also remember Haigh calling for the then Home Secretary Amber Rudd to be stand down for deliberately misleading Parliament over immigrant targets. And in another call this time the Johnson cake saga posting on X “you can’t make the rules then break the rules. You can’t have one rule for yourself and different rules for everybody else”.
Of course I understand those on the left have a different view of things when it’s one of there own . I can only imagine the furore if this had been a Tory Minister on these pages.
But I’m surprised that someone who stated they were an retired policeman is so gullible to believe her story about it all being a horrible mistake.
She claimed she was mugged then claimed a mobile phone was stolen ,then applies for a more expensive updated version.
Is investigated by the police who obviously didn’t believe her story who then either arrested or report her, she is charged and pleads guilty in court and receives a conditional discharge. Which is a court order imposed for a minor crime where the offender admits guilt and the offender avoids punishment if they don’t commit another crime. Haigh of course could have said at anytime she had remembered her phone was not stolen but chose not to ,for instance as soon as she realised it wasn’t stolen, or during her police interview or even in court but chose not to which seems to point to the evidence was pretty strong against her innocence claims.
Haigh could have come clean at the out set of her political career when she was first elected MP which she could have done as she didn’t receive a custodial sentence ,or at least declaring it when she was pick by Starmer to be a minister but she chose not to. If she had she would have still been in post and Sky News would have had no story which started this ball rolling.
in addition to which the Insuranec company she worked for carries out there own internal investigation and sacks her.
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Nov 29, 2024 14:54:15 GMT
You've got to love Parliament, at the end of the very emotive and intense assisted dying vote Lindsay Hoyle says:
"Right, thank you everybody. We're going to move on to the ferrets bill if people wish to leave."
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 29, 2024 14:55:55 GMT
I am glad to see the large majority of lib dem mps passing the second reading of the bill with over 80% in favour a far higher percentage than among Labour mps.
It's always been liberal democrats basic position to give individuals as much control over their own lives as possible.
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Post by graham on Nov 29, 2024 14:59:11 GMT
Assisted dying Bill passed the second reading MPs supported the bill by 330 to 275, a majority of 55. Bigger majority than I thought it would be, the hard work of the Committee stage starts now It may struggle in the House of Lords. |
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 29, 2024 14:59:59 GMT
turkJohnson received a fine because he broke the lockdown rules his government inflicted on all the rest of us. It's not illegal to eat cake.
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Nov 29, 2024 15:02:02 GMT
It's always been liberal democrats basic position to give individuals as much control over their own lives as possible. I hope they do something about self-checkouts then 👍 |
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 29, 2024 15:12:35 GMT
Former prime minister Sunak one of just 23 Tories who voted in favour of the bill.
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Post by pete on Nov 29, 2024 15:22:47 GMT
Maga Mike in danger of losing effectively the house majority now sitting at 215:217 until at least April Special elections. they have zero chance of 100% unity. What a tragedy the mags loons will be unable to police the capital to keep the one trans congresswoman out of MTG's toilets. All the seats currently vacant should be safe republican holds but who knows if the chaos anticipated when the lunatic takes office transpires. There are also a couple of what passes for moderate republicans notably Brian Fitzpatrick a former FBI special agent , who will be less than impressed with the lunatics teams efforts to politicize and defund federal agencies. 'Special elections?' |
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 29, 2024 15:34:55 GMT
peteThe us equivalent of by elections. Three of the lunatics picks for his cabinet are sitting members of the house, if confirmed they need to resign their congressional seats. The by elections for their replacements will be April at the earliest.
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Nov 29, 2024 15:41:54 GMT
BJ versus Corbyn - the public knew who they preferred. My guess is that they would still make the same choice if asked again today. Blimey-talk about Rock and Hard Place ! used to ask about Boris vs Corbyn on the old board - not many replies! Asked about Foot vs. Thatcher too (and that also was mostly tumbleweed - one non-Tory said they’d prefer Thatch…) |
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Post by nickpoole on Nov 29, 2024 15:49:27 GMT
Blimey-talk about Rock and Hard Place ! used to ask about Boris vs Corbyn on the old board - not many replies! Asked about Foot vs. Thatcher too (and that also was mostly tumbleweed - one non-Tory said they’d prefer Thatch…) I voted for Foot and Corbyn, and both would have done a lot less damage than Thatcher, May or Johnson. |
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Nov 29, 2024 15:56:57 GMT
used to ask about Boris vs Corbyn on the old board - not many replies! Asked about Foot vs. Thatcher too (and that also was mostly tumbleweed - one non-Tory said they’d prefer Thatch…) I voted for Foot and Corbyn, and both would have done a lot less damage than Thatcher, May or Johnson. It’s interesting how little flak Thatcher gets from some. Some say they even admire the way she got things done. I don’t find that very persuasive, given Social Democrats had split the left vote, and it’s much easier to destroy and sell off than to create. There was also at times almost a warm regard for Heath, but then he did take us into the EC which might please some |
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 29, 2024 16:00:26 GMT
Someone I think it was jib said the results of the congressional elections in California were what pushed the republicans over the line.
Well they have just about finished counting now.
The final result a gain of three seats for the democrats!.
The House elections have, despite their issues, been far more representative of votes cast than the gerrymandered Presidential electoral college or the totally unrepresentative Senate elections.
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Post by shevii on Nov 29, 2024 16:01:19 GMT
I'm not sure what the conclusion of our discussion on religion in the assisted dying bill but the figures available are:
MPs sworn in on religious text- 138 for, 215 against
MPs sworn in on affirmation- 192 for, 60 against
Quite clearly (and of course many who swear on religious text aren't necessarily very religious) religion played a massive part in the way an MP voted.
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 29, 2024 16:03:51 GMT
The only crime of any significance that I see Louise Haigh to be culpable of is one against fashion.  But I l love the hair. |
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Post by leftieliberal on Nov 29, 2024 16:03:55 GMT
"A Tory minister can sleep in ten different women's beds in a week. A Labour minister gets it in the neck if he looks at his neighbour's wife over the garden fence." - Clement Attlee Makes you wonder if Attlee had any particular Tory minister in mind  . , possibly. |
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colin
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Post by colin on Nov 29, 2024 16:04:20 GMT
You have to wonder if Musk is deliberately or at least uncaringly driving some of his businesses into the ground: www.theguardian.com/technology/2024/nov/29/tesla-owners-elon-musk Very anecdotally in liberal EV driver heavy Oxfordshire I've seen vanishingly few new registration Teslas in the last few months. Not that long ago they seemed to be everywhere. It might not be anecdotal - I posted the Telegraph graphic the other day showing how EV sales were falling behind expectations. How much it’s to do unrealistic expectations, with Musk, or with prices not falling enough, not enough chargers or indeed other things, I’m not sure about EV anecdote heard today. Cant vouch for its veracity. EV driver breaks down & needs wheel changing. Cannot use regular breakdown service because of non0standard wheel/tyre and weight of car. "specialist" assistance cost £275 |
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steve
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Post by steve on Nov 29, 2024 16:06:58 GMT
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Nov 29, 2024 16:11:08 GMT
George Eaton
@georgeeaton.bsky.social
'A remarkable stat: Heidi Alexander’s appointment as Transport Secretary means the cabinet is now 100% state-educated for the first time in history'
You could argue that as Starmer’s school became private during his time there it's not 100%, but still a remarkable change to recent Cabinets
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Post by leftieliberal on Nov 29, 2024 16:16:15 GMT
It's always been liberal democrats basic position to give individuals as much control over their own lives as possible. I hope they do something about self-checkouts then 👍 Personally, I'm against self-checkouts; I always go to a staffed checkout if possible. I don't see why I should help supermarkets to reduce the number of their staff (and I usually chat to the checkout staff as well). I'm fighting a losing battle here, my regular supermarket has just reduced the number of staffed checkouts from 5 to 4 and increased the number of self-checkouts from 6 to 8. Often, when I shop there is only one staffed checkout operating. |
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colin
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Post by colin on Nov 29, 2024 16:21:01 GMT
George Eaton @georgeeaton.bsky.social 'A remarkable stat: Heidi Alexander’s appointment as Transport Secretary means the cabinet is now 100% state-educated for the first time in history' You could argue that as Starmer’s school became private during his time there it's not 100%, but still a remarkable change to recent Cabinets Not a believer in diversity then ? |
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