neilj
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Post by neilj on Nov 29, 2024 7:42:54 GMT
Real life Levelling up instead of just a vacuous slogan www.theguardian.com/society/2024/nov/28/council-funding-redirected-rich-areas-most-deprived-england-local-governmentMinisters have said they will redirect cash from wealthy areas to England’s most deprived town and cities, reversing a trend established during a decade of austerity in a shake-up of local government funding. The government also said it would consider “on a case-by-case basis” requests from cash-strapped councils who wanted to balance their books by raising council tax above the current threshold of 5% for upper-tier authorities and 3% for districts. |
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Post by jib on Nov 29, 2024 7:58:24 GMT
Breaking (source Telegraph) Transport Secretary Louise Haigh resigns after admitting she pleaded guilty to misleading police In a letter to Keir Starmer, Ms Haigh said she was ‘sorry to leave’ but the issue would ‘inevitably be a distraction’ for the government Edit: Sums it up. Not a favourite of mine, but if the BBC report is to be believed this is not a resigning offence. Mugged as a young woman & mistaken about a stolen phone ? ! www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cdxy1kp73y9oWhy did Starmer not refuse her resignation and support her ? Maybe he asked her to go ? Who knows why she jumped, she could have stuck I would have said. There will be no shortage of talented runners and riders for that key post. |
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Nov 29, 2024 8:02:48 GMT
If Louise Hague didn't go the tory press would have kept banging on about it
It's not fair, but it's reality and it would have become a running sore, damaging her and the Labour Government
Even now she's gone I expect they will find a way to criticise Starmer
I hope her selfless act means she will return to a Government role in the future
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colin
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Post by colin on Nov 29, 2024 8:14:57 GMT
colin Ms Haigh is correct the Tory supporting media would no doubt have made a huge song and dance about it if she stayed. Possibly because she called for their leader to resign and called for "trust and respect" in HoC ? |
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colin
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Post by colin on Nov 29, 2024 8:19:05 GMT
If Louise Hague didn't go the tory press would have kept banging on about it It's not fair, but it's reality and it would have become a running sore, damaging her and the Labour Government Even now she's gone I expect they will find a way to criticise Starmer I hope her selfless act means she will return to a Government role in the future So critical media shapes this Starmer Government ? The objective is to have no criticism in a dead tree press that hardly anyone reads ? |
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Nov 29, 2024 8:24:38 GMT
If Louise Hague didn't go the tory press would have kept banging on about it It's not fair, but it's reality and it would have become a running sore, damaging her and the Labour Government Even now she's gone I expect they will find a way to criticise Starmer I hope her selfless act means she will return to a Government role in the future So critical media shapes this Starmer Government ? The objective is to have no criticism in a dead tree press that hardly anyone reads ? You're an intelligent person, you know criticism effects Government and always has, this isn't something unique to Starmer, we've seen it repeated time and time again The alternative is a slow drip feed of negative stories that dominate the headlines and distracts away from message, with the eventual result being she goes anyway in a few weeks time |
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Post by neilj on Nov 29, 2024 8:28:03 GMT
Despite many siren voices UK Gilts yields are now lower than they were when Reeves stood up to start her Budget speech.
Well done Angela
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colin
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Post by colin on Nov 29, 2024 8:33:21 GMT
So critical media shapes this Starmer Government ? The objective is to have no criticism in a dead tree press that hardly anyone reads ? You're an intelligent person, you know criticism effects Government and always has, this isn't something unique to Starmer, we've seen it repeated time and time again The alternative is a slow drip feed of negative stories that dominate the headlines and distracts away from message, with the eventual result being she goes anyway in a few weeks time Two thoughts- I dont think any government should be shaping its policies and conduct primarily to avoid criticism in the legacy press. Young people don't read the legacy press . |
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Nov 29, 2024 8:40:26 GMT
You're an intelligent person, you know criticism effects Government and always has, this isn't something unique to Starmer, we've seen it repeated time and time again The alternative is a slow drip feed of negative stories that dominate the headlines and distracts away from message, with the eventual result being she goes anyway in a few weeks time Two thoughts- I dont think any government should be shaping its policies and conduct primarily to avoid criticism in the legacy press. Young people don't read the legacy press . It's a question of priorities, if it's something important, such as inheritance tax on farms, VAT on private schools etc I agree. An individual minister who did something wrong in the past resigning, I don't think is worth dying in a ditch for As to young people not reading legacy media, you are right. But they do get their media on line and you tube etc, these sort of stories feature there. Twitter under Musk would be especially critical That's without the fact that older people still get a lot of their news via print, tv and radio news and we know from past experience it would feature highly |
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Post by barbara on Nov 29, 2024 8:50:15 GMT
Well it’s a danger to have skewed media either way. Like I said, Musk is upping the ante because of the Dem media dominance and much greater funding which is also not healthy. They can share the load so each outfit doesn’t have to be as bad individually. And you gloss over Twitter bias before Musk. E.g. the Hunter Biden affair basically you seem to have decided it’s OK to cheat as long as they support your views, and as long as they only cheat in the way that your favourites have found suits them to cheat You've gone so far down the rabbit hole You've ended up in Australia None of that is remotely akin to my views and most of it is inaccurate and straight from the right wing conspiracy theorist handbook I long ago came to the view that c-a-r-f-r-e-w is an agent provocateur. I don't know if he really believes in anything but what he loves most is taking up contrary positions to wind people up. It's how he gets his kicks. |
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Nov 29, 2024 8:58:54 GMT
You've gone so far down the rabbit hole You've ended up in Australia None of that is remotely akin to my views and most of it is inaccurate and straight from the right wing conspiracy theorist handbook I long ago came to the view that c-a-r-f-r-e-w is an agent provocateur. I don't know if he really believes in anything but what he loves most is taking up contrary positions to wind people up. It's how he gets his kicks. You could be right Barbara, all I notice is that his posts are mostly critical of Labour, with little or no criticism of the tories or Reform. Indeed he minimises criticism of them and dangerous people like Musk by conflating it with much less serious issues from the other side. In my view he's an enabler for the right and hard right But I could and did live with that, but life's too short to engage with someone, who not once, but several times questioned my honesty |
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colin
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Post by colin on Nov 29, 2024 9:08:41 GMT
Two thoughts- I dont think any government should be shaping its policies and conduct primarily to avoid criticism in the legacy press. Young people don't read the legacy press . It's a question of priorities, if it's something important, such as inheritance tax on farms, VAT on private schools etc I agree. An individual minister who did something wrong in the past resigning, I don't think is worth dying in a ditch for As to young people not reading legacy media, you are right. But they do get their media on line and you tube etc, these sort of stories feature there. Twitter under Musk would be especially critical That's without the fact that older people still get a lot of their news via print, tv and radio news and we know from past experience it would feature highly No LOC supporting online news sources ?? |
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Nov 29, 2024 9:24:15 GMT
It's a question of priorities, if it's something important, such as inheritance tax on farms, VAT on private schools etc I agree. An individual minister who did something wrong in the past resigning, I don't think is worth dying in a ditch for As to young people not reading legacy media, you are right. But they do get their media on line and you tube etc, these sort of stories feature there. Twitter under Musk would be especially critical That's without the fact that older people still get a lot of their news via print, tv and radio news and we know from past experience it would feature highly No LOC supporting online news sources ?? You only need to read this board to realise that the most left wing people/sources are most critical of Starmer. This is even more amplified in the wider online community The only paper that consistently supports Labour is the Mirror This is made worse on twitter under Musk as he throttles back posts supportive of Labour and amplifies those critical of Starmer. Reading Blusky this morning I see Musk is now retweeting and agreeing with Andrea Jenkins post that Reform will win the next General election Let that sink in, a foreign multi billionaire and close Trump associate is actively campaigning for Reform |
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colin
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Post by colin on Nov 29, 2024 9:33:56 GMT
No LOC supporting online news sources ?? You only need to read this board to realise that the most left wing people/sources are most critical of Starmer. This is even more amplified in the wider online community The only paper that consistently supports Labour is the Mirror This is made worse on twitter under Musk as he throttles back posts supportive of Labour and amplifies those critical of Starmer. Reading Blusky this morning I see Musk is now retweeting and agreeing with Andrea Jenkins post that Reform will win the next General election Let that sink in, a foreign multi billionaire and close Trump associate is actively campaigning for Reform Oh dear. Billy No Mates then ? |
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Post by shevii on Nov 29, 2024 9:35:40 GMT
mercian - "On those immigration figures, when net immigration is 50% higher than live births in the country surely something drastic must be done, not just pious words as we got from the Tories until their very late restrictions on students bringing dependents." Unlike you, I couldn't give a fig about the proportion of migrants to births in the UK population mix, but I think we share a deep concern over the truly massive scale of immigration. As I said yesterday, in two years, net migration added a population equivalent to the cities of Liverpool, Manchester, Bristol and Coventry combined. There was little comment on this at all, which I suspect is because the RoC posters are embarrassed that their lot screwed up so badly, while the LoC posters are uncomfortable trying to defend such horrendous levels of migration but don't want to break the rule about not criticising immigration because of the ingrained cultural assumption that to question it makes you a fruitcake, loon or racist. It's a huge story but was barely touched here yesterday. Difficult to run like for like figures on this as much of the immigration is likely to be to the cities where there is more need but where only limited action can be taken on housing. It makes the policy of building 1.5m homes rather pointless in the long term if there's no plan to stabilise the population numbers and location not being well thought out in terms of transport connections or need. Swathes of green land of some description are going to be built on, if it even happens, just to leave the next government to need to increase housing by a similar figure. This assumes that Labour is not able to cut net immigration to Cameron's tens of thousands and it also assumes there will be a take up in the places where the builds are. No party seems to have a joined up plan on population and I include the Greens in this. The only party that might would be Reform and their policies are likely to be very nasty and not thought out either but we have only ourselves to blame if Reform or right wing Tories start to gain even more traction. I agree that there will be costs to this in re-balancing the economy away from reliance on immigration but I do believe we have the young people available to deal with the care issue- it's just at the moment even the gig economy and hospitality have better employment terms than going into care. Better to face this now than to have the same situation indefinitely. I also think there is a lot of dishonesty in the debate on refugees. Sadly we can't take every refugee who wants/needs to come here. I think if we are to have immigration they should be a priority, but ultimately the whole of the stop the boats business is because governments realise there are limits but can't formulate a quota system that doesn't seem cruel. Every European country is doing the same sort of thing by muddying the issue while talking about "genuine" refugees as though by weeding out the non genuine ones we are going to fix things. I'm very conflicted myself on this and don't really have a humane answer but governments are substituting hostile environment for a joined up policy. |
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Nov 29, 2024 9:39:18 GMT
You only need to read this board to realise that the most left wing people/sources are most critical of Starmer. This is even more amplified in the wider online community The only paper that consistently supports Labour is the Mirror This is made worse on twitter under Musk as he throttles back posts supportive of Labour and amplifies those critical of Starmer. Reading Blusky this morning I see Musk is now retweeting and agreeing with Andrea Jenkins post that Reform will win the next General election Let that sink in, a foreign multi billionaire and close Trump associate is actively campaigning for Reform Oh dear. Billy No Mates then ? Lots of mates, getting their voices heard is the problem Hopefully Bluesky with it's fairness of access will start to redress the balance |
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Post by guymonde on Nov 29, 2024 9:40:11 GMT
Personally I think Louise Haigh had to resign because of her conviction.
No, not the one about a phone.
The conviction she shows recently, about needing the UK to have a fairer society.
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Post by neilj on Nov 29, 2024 9:41:40 GMT
Good news, Speaker has not selected the wrecking amendment by Ben Spencer, tory, so straightforward Yes-No vote at about 2.30pm
Chamber looks packed
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colin
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Post by colin on Nov 29, 2024 9:47:09 GMT
I don't often turn to the Guardian for words of wisdom, but this article is a huge wake up call for the complacent centre left/right and the cosy world of the Grand Coalition. The power of TikTok and its ilk -on young and old alike too. www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/nov/29/romania-elections-calin-georgescu-presidentRomania is an EU member state , a member of NATO and home to major western military bases. Putin doesn't need missiles to attack our way of life.Once he has the political reins , Georgia today is the model. |
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Post by shevii on Nov 29, 2024 9:52:45 GMT
I didnt know he had that connection. Maybe because no-one wants to highlight it outside of left wing twitter? The whole Epstein business makes me very angry- rich and powerful people, that include Mandelson, Clinton, Trump etc, have created a wall of silence that the FBI has not been able to break down, just the same with Jimmy Saville where people were talking about him as early as the 1980's. I'm not saying that Mandelson knew anything but what I'm saying is that he has never been questioned on this by the press and is able to hind behind a solicitor's bland comment "I can't recall" and carry on as normal. You'd think he would have some sort of records to indicate where he was when it is alleged he was staying at Epstein's flat while Epstein was in prison. "In 2008, Epstein was given an 18-month sentence after pleading guilty to procuring an underage girl. He served time at the private wing of the Palm Beach county stockade in Florida before being released on probation on 22 July 2009. The JP Morgan report reveals that Epstein wrote to his private banker, Jes Staley, on 17 June 2009 in relation to Mandelson to say: “Peter will be staying at 71st over weekend, do you want to organize either you, or you and Jamie,, quiertly [sic],, up to you.” At the time, Lord Mandelson was business secretary in the government of Gordon Brown." I don't see how people give the man the time of day and ignore something as serious as this. |
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colin
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Post by colin on Nov 29, 2024 9:57:05 GMT
I didnt know he had that connection. Maybe because no-one wants to highlight it outside of left wing twitter? The whole Epstein business makes me very angry- rich and powerful people, that include Mandelson, Clinton, Trump etc, have created a wall of silence that the FBI has not been able to break down, just the same with Jimmy Saville where people were talking about him as early as the 1980's. I'm not saying that Mandelson knew anything but what I'm saying is that he has never been questioned on this by the press and is able to hind behind a solicitor's bland comment "I can't recall" and carry on as normal. You'd think he would have some sort of records to indicate where he was when it is alleged he was staying at Epstein's flat while Epstein was in prison. "In 2008, Epstein was given an 18-month sentence after pleading guilty to procuring an underage girl. He served time at the private wing of the Palm Beach county stockade in Florida before being released on probation on 22 July 2009. The JP Morgan report reveals that Epstein wrote to his private banker, Jes Staley, on 17 June 2009 in relation to Mandelson to say: “Peter will be staying at 71st over weekend, do you want to organize either you, or you and Jamie,, quiertly [sic],, up to you.” At the time, Lord Mandelson was business secretary in the government of Gordon Brown." I don't see how people give the man the time of day and ignore something as serious as this. THanks shevii I have never liked him as a person whilst admiring his political skills. Indeed i have been thinking that if he is appointed UK Ambassador to USA his EU Trade experience and triangulating skills might be an asset with a protectionist and volatile Trump. I wonder what attitude Trump has now to Epstein's "friends" ? |
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johntel
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Post by johntel on Nov 29, 2024 10:07:26 GMT
Personally I think Louise Haigh had to resign because of her conviction. No, not the one about a phone. The conviction she shows recently, about needing the UK to have a fairer society. If she did it once it could be written off as a genuine mistake. But apparently she did it in multiple occasions but was only charged for one offence. So she had to go. |
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neilj
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Post by neilj on Nov 29, 2024 10:07:37 GMT
Maybe because no-one wants to highlight it outside of left wing twitter? The whole Epstein business makes me very angry- rich and powerful people, that include Mandelson, Clinton, Trump etc, have created a wall of silence that the FBI has not been able to break down, just the same with Jimmy Saville where people were talking about him as early as the 1980's. I'm not saying that Mandelson knew anything but what I'm saying is that he has never been questioned on this by the press and is able to hind behind a solicitor's bland comment "I can't recall" and carry on as normal. You'd think he would have some sort of records to indicate where he was when it is alleged he was staying at Epstein's flat while Epstein was in prison. "In 2008, Epstein was given an 18-month sentence after pleading guilty to procuring an underage girl. He served time at the private wing of the Palm Beach county stockade in Florida before being released on probation on 22 July 2009. The JP Morgan report reveals that Epstein wrote to his private banker, Jes Staley, on 17 June 2009 in relation to Mandelson to say: “Peter will be staying at 71st over weekend, do you want to organize either you, or you and Jamie,, quiertly [sic],, up to you.” At the time, Lord Mandelson was business secretary in the government of Gordon Brown." I don't see how people give the man the time of day and ignore something as serious as this. THanks shevii I have never liked him as a person whilst admiring his political skills. Indeed i have been thinking that if he is appointed UK Ambassador to USA his EU Trade experience and triangulating skills might be an asset with a protectionist and volatile Trump. I wonder what attitude Trump has now to Epstein's "friends" ? Similar thoughts to me about Mandelson As to Trump as he was a close friend of Epstein "The future president claimed in 2002 that he had a long friendship with Epstein. "I've known Jeff for 15 years. Terrific guy," Trump said, according to New York Magazine. "He's a lot of fun to be with. It is even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do, and many of them are on the younger side. No doubt about it — Jeffrey enjoys his social life." Sexual predators do tend to gravitate to each other |
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Post by wb61 on Nov 29, 2024 10:20:47 GMT
Personally I think Louise Haigh had to resign because of her conviction. No, not the one about a phone. The conviction she shows recently, about needing the UK to have a fairer society. If she did it once it could be written off as a genuine mistake. But apparently she did it in multiple occasions but was only charged for one offence. So she had to go. ? source please |
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johntel
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Post by johntel on Nov 29, 2024 10:36:20 GMT
If she did it once it could be written off as a genuine mistake. But apparently she did it in multiple occasions but was only charged for one offence. So she had to go. ? source please The Guardian, The Times and Sky News. |
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domjg
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Post by domjg on Nov 29, 2024 10:58:43 GMT
colin You can't compare Romania to Georgia. The latter has been consistently corrupt und unstable (with parts of it's territory unrecognized mini states) since 1991. It's really no loss and it's accession talks to the EU would have been lip service only in my opinion. What happened in Romania is worrying and it seems something shady may have happened (though it might say more about the failure of their polling than anything else) but the president there is a largely ceremonial role and therefore may have allowed somewhat of a protest vote. I admit though this shows the dangers of information manipulation. Relatively speaking Romania is stable and doing well and is just about to be admitted to Schengen so it doesn't make sense. I know they do feel worried about Ukraine next door and are by nature not as vociferously anti-Russian as the Poles are for example who feel more of a natural affinity to Ukraine culturally. I was having a drink (or several) with my Romanian neighbour a few weeks back. He was telling me how worthless he used to feel a Romanian passport was prior to joining the EU and the troubles he had back in the 00s getting a work visa in France. We joked about how his Romanian passport is now far more useful than a British one.
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Nov 29, 2024 11:13:33 GMT
I long ago came to the view that c-a-r-f-r-e-w is an agent provocateur. I don't know if he really believes in anything but what he loves most is taking up contrary positions to wind people up. It's how he gets his kicks. You could be right Barbara, all I notice is that his posts are mostly critical of Labour, with little or no criticism of the tories or Reform. Indeed he minimises criticism of them and dangerous people like Musk by conflating it with much less serious issues from the other side. In my view he's an enabler for the right and hard right But I could and did live with that, but life's too short to engage with someone, who not once, but several times questioned my honesty Good job no one suggested Carfrew was supporting Musk when he didn’t - that wouldn’t be very fair if he just pointed out other media weren’t always nobly “following the science”. Or kept suggesting was against IHT when simply wondered about phasing it in more slowly. Now it’s even worse: he is mostly critical of Labour apparently. More making up bad stuff about Carfrew from barbara ’s favourite professional victim and agent provocateur! You would expect more criticism of the government since they are doing more, which some might still struggle to accept. But how much have I been critical of this government really? The inheritance tax? I didn’t oppose it, just wondered if it was possible to phase it in more gradually. The NIC increase? I said it might have some negative effects but they could be net positive depending on how they spent the tax. Meanwhile I supported the extra house building, the green energy investment, accelerating SMRs, the pay rises, a cautious thumbs up over what Streeting is trying to do: preventative health etc. And on a number of occasions have supported Starmer, suggesting he might be a bit more to the left than it might seem. Obviously it’s early days and you have to see how things pan out - if despite the investment, energy prices don’t come down much etc., and if Streeting sets targets, will they be good ones etc. But my main criticisms of late have concerned not this government but past governments and deindustrialising etc., and by implication, I don’t support the neolib policies of Reform etc. - most people wouldn’t need a regular announcement of that rather obvious fact. |
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Post by domjg on Nov 29, 2024 11:22:36 GMT
The Guardian, The Times and Sky News. Sounds like the right wing press are trying to twist it into something they can use. She denies reporting it lost several times. Having said that, getting a new work phone from your employer (she couldn't even use the old one as it would be locked down) compared to the misappropriation of millions and law breaking that the tories got up to? As ever the tories get away with murder, Labour are put in the stocks for (allegedly) stealing a loaf of bread. |
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Post by steve on Nov 29, 2024 11:25:16 GMT
Trump cabinet selection hearing.  |
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Post by c-a-r-f-r-e-w on Nov 29, 2024 11:27:11 GMT
You've gone so far down the rabbit hole You've ended up in Australia None of that is remotely akin to my views and most of it is inaccurate and straight from the right wing conspiracy theorist handbook I long ago came to the view that c-a-r-f-r-e-w is an agent provocateur. I don't know if he really believes in anything but what he loves most is taking up contrary positions to wind people up. It's how he gets his kicks. I could disagree a whole lot more if I wanted to. I find lots to agree on with many on the board. Some people only notice the disagreement, are hyper-sensitive to it, or even imagine disagreement when it isn’t there. (Sometimes things might start off with some disagreement but work towards common ground. So for example, in the chats about social democracy - we might have started with more disagreement but I’ve gradually incorporated bits of what pjw1961 , lululemonmustdobetter and laszlo4new had to say on the matter into a more hybrid view). There tend to be two cultures on the board. One group often chat quite pleasantly about things despite having quite differing political and other opinions and it only occasionally gets a bit difficult. Another group mostly only get on with those who share much the same opinion as them, and it’s often more fractious with others since very intolerant of difference (if not utter avoidance of those with other views) |
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